Operation Unthinkable and Operation Dandelion

RogerCooper

@Major-Arcana said in Operation Unthinkable and Operation Dandelion:

Can you have victory condition that requires a specific unit to attack a specific territory?
Yes. You could have a victory condition that specifies having a specific unit in a specific spot at the end of combat movement.

You could also have a nuclear bomber with a maxbuild of 1 to prevent spamming or simply give 1 nuclear bomb a turn without a purchase.

Major Arcana

@wc_sumpton Was thinking a new mod, but going to a second alliance/victory set up after winning the first is a cool idea. Would make for some very long games!

Major Arcana

@RogerCooper Another thought I had, could it be possible to have a nuke bomber that can only land and take off from airbases, the same way the americans had to build a special base for the enola gay? So goal one would be to build and protect an airbase within range of the enemy capital, then goal two is to make the attack without getting shot down.

ff03k64

While that idea is neat, it would just make me not win the first condition until i was ready to win the second condition as well. Unless there was some randomness to what the second condition was. I also tend to play all players on one side, so with a WW2 variant, i would end up playing as Japan and Germany, but they would end up against each other after that.

RogerCooper

@Major-Arcana Yes. You could have a unit with a move of 0 that gets a movement bonus from a base.

Major Arcana

@RogerCooper said in Operation Unthinkable and Operation Dandelion:

hat gets a movement bonus fro

So for a bomber you set the move to 0 but the move bonus to 6 (or whatever range you want)
?

RogerCooper

@Major-Arcana Yes. Take a look at The Grand War mod, where nukes are suicide air units with a speed of 1, but get a movement boost if they start with a bomber.

Major Arcana

@RogerCooper And you could restrict it to being built in a specific territory industrial complex? I.e. you always have to fly your nuke over from your capital

RogerCooper

@Major-Arcana Yes.

Don't be afraid to look at the xml. Look at existing mods and see how things are done.

RogerCooper

@Major-Arcana said in Operation Unthinkable and Operation Dandelion:

Hi All,
Long time player here, been fiddling with edit mode to create two new save game scenarios for WWII Global. These are relatively playable but I don't have the skills to finish them off properly.

Operation Unthinkable.tsvg
Operation Dandelion.tsvg

Both scenarios are based on continuation of war after a victory in WWII, where the victorious nations turn on each other.

Operation Unthinkable is the allied victory scenario with Germany defeated and Japan occupied by the USA.
The western allies of UK, USA, France and Anzacs fear a soviet takeover of Western Europe and declare war on of the eastern allies of Russia and communist China. The Communists start with more land units on the ground and are poised to sweep across Europe, Asia and Africa. The Capitalists have control of the seas and strategic position, but have less materiel on the ground to resist the communist bloc. It's based on the actual plan briefly considered by Churchill in 1945. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Unthinkable The main problem with this as a save game is I'd like China to be a full player with a capital, the ability to invade external territories, etc.

Operation Dandelion is the axis victory scenario, with the world divided into sphere of influence ruled by the Fascist bloc of Germany-Italy and their new rival Imperial Japan. The remaining Russians, Anzacs and the Free French in Africa retain some territory and wage guerrilla war against both blocs. Likewise the USA is reduced to a buffer state between the Germany east coast and the Japanese west coast of the Americas. The Fascists have come out of WWII in the strongest position, but grow uneasy as the Japanese Empire establishes strategic bases around the globe while continuing to expand its formidable navy. The Germans plot to undertake a decisive nuclear first strike on the Japanese home islands to destroy the Empire entirely. This is based on the book The Man in the High Castle by Philip K Dick https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Operation_Dandelion For this scenario I'd like the guerrilla nations to operate under Chinese game mechanics. My idea is that the victory condition for the Fascists is to maneuver heavy bombers into range of Japan and achieve 20 hits on the production facility in one round, to simulate a decisive nuclear strike. To base bombers in range of Japan the Fascists will need to decide whether to go overland across asia, take the west coast of the americas, or attempt to control the pacific islands. The Japanese victory would be to prevent the Fascists gaining territory within range of Japan and to turn the war by occupy either one of the Fascist capitals, either by an overland assault across Europe or a naval invasion from Asia or America.

Anyone out there want to take this on?

I am taking a look at your save files. I can turn them into full scenarios. Giving a capital or removing a capital is easy. I assume I can remove the National Objectives. For nukes, I can just make an effective heavy bomber with only 1 that can be built.

Major Arcana

Thats great Roger. Yeah no national objectives unless you can think of some new ones that might be fun. If the bomber has a limit of 1 at a time, costs heaps (say 100pus) and can only be built in the capital, that would suit the concept.
Cheers.

RogerCooper

@Major-Arcana If a bomber has a high cost, then it will be less effective than conventional weapons.

Major Arcana

Yes so you wouldn't use them in normal combat, but I was thinking the 'dandelion' victory condition is triggered by a successful attack on the Japanese capital with the special nuclear unit.

RogerCooper

@Major-Arcana Why would a single nuclear attack end the war? In WW2, it took 2 nuclear attacks, after a year of conventional attacks with similar effects, after the Japanese navy had been destroyed, for the Japanese to surrender.

Major Arcana

That's the plot of Operation Dandelion from the book. The Nazis want to defeat Japan to be the sole superpower, but realize they can't defeat their huge empire head on in a conventional war. The Nazis are the only power with nuclear bombs but fear the Japanese are only months away from developing nuclear weapons of their own. The operation is a surprise nuclear attack on their former allies, a simultaneous bombing of major cities and military targets across the Japanese home islands to blow them out of existence (like a dandelion!). So not a single bombing, but a single coordinated decapitation strike.

I guess the two sides shouldn't start at war, not full allies but not yet at war so there is a few rounds of maneuvering before one side decides to attach.

RogerCooper

I read an RPG in which Nazi Germany uses in nuclear weapons against Imperial Japan which retaliates with biological weapons. 20% of the world's population dies from the biowar. The Japanese home islands are sterilized. An even, darker alternate history.

RogerCooper

I have been working on converting Operation Dandelion to a full scenario.I have been removing the unused nations and will consolidate the various neutrals.I don't expect much respect for neutrality at this point by anyone. I gave the 2 British units to the US.

I am not sure how to handle Russia, America & France. In practical terms, the Germans need to either ally or attack Russia & America to get at the Japanese. It would seem for balance, that they should ally with Japan.

Major Arcana

Thanks Roger!

I think if you consolidate the neutrals as True Neutrals, the have the same mechanics as Global. I.e. either side needs to declare war on them, then they ally with the other side.

That way the Fascists need to maneuver and pick the right time to fight their way across neutral territory (or find a way around), or the Japanese can declare war and move first to get a stronger position.

That would suggest two three phases to a game:

The two sides are not at war and the neutrals are neutral.
The two sides are not at war, but the neutrals are at war with one side and allied with the other.
The two sides are at war, the neutrals are at war with one side and allied with the other.

RogerCooper

@Major-Arcana There is not much point to having a phase where nobody is fighting, as you could simply start the game when the actual fighting begins.

It seems the whole point of Operation Dandelion is to launch a surprise attack.The buffer states were designed to be in the way and logically the Fascists must attack them and the Japanese will support them.The Nazis are assuming that nuclear weapons will give them the edge they need to win before the Japanese can match them.

To work this in TripleA, I would make nuclear weapons a bomber-type unit which rolls 6 dice but also make it a suicide unit.The Germans would receive 1 nuclear bomber per turn and the Japanese would at a point as well. No nuclear bomber would be received if the enemy has a nuclear bomber in range of your capital.

Give the Germans a deadline before economic strain and political infighting force an end to the war.

RogerCooper

@Major-Arcana I have taken the save file you posted, fixed the errors and split the buffer states with America, Russia and France allied with Japan and Australia with Germany. I gave everyone starting money equal to income.

To reflect the initial attack, I took away Japan's starting money. Nonetheless, the Japanese seem to recover quickly.

To make this a workable scenario, more needs to be done. Germany needs to be stronger or Japan weaker. Or we could give the Germans some nukes to use during the game. But basically it needs to a race against time, with the Germans needing to take the East Asian territories with which they can easily nuke Japan before Japan develops its own nukes.

Operation-Dandelion.xml