K
@Cernel said in Domination 1914 No Man's Land - Official Thread:
@KurtGodel7 said in Domination 1914 No Man's Land - Official Thread:
If a territory is defended with pure trenches, the above cannot be done. As you pointed out, conscripts only are stranded when attacking trenches only. But there's an easy workaround for someone familiar with how this works: simply attack the trench with conscripts + 1 unit with offensive firepower. You don't have to worry about winning the battle and getting stranded in the territory you're attempting to teleport through, because trenches have two hitpoints.
Actually, no, if by "pure trenches" you mean trenches alone. As you can test, if you attack a territory with 1 trench and no other units using 1 infantry, the trench is immediately removed, and you are unable to retreat. So, either for stalemate, if sending all conscripts, or auto destruction, if sending anything else than conscripts (doesn't matter if together with conscripts), you can never strafe trenches alone.
If the trenches are not alone, then you can strafe with only conscripts, so I don't get where you are getting here. That infantry, or whatever, added to a conscript attacking stack, will avoid you stalemating against only trenches, that's right, but will cause all trenches being instantly removed, instead, so, either ways, you cannot retreat.
So, I'm really not understanding if I'm missing something here, or what?
Anyways, I wonder if the players of this map are also aware that:
The retreat before stalemate is bugged, so, if extending the stalemate to conscripts alone attacking trenches alone, then you should be able to strafe, in this case (the bug is that the engine stalemates you before giving you the option to retreat).
The retreat before auto removal units is bugged, if it happens after the first round of combat, so, if extending the auto removal to anything but conscripts alone attacking trenches alone, the defender should be able to assign hits so to leave only trenches surviving, and, this way, negating the attacker the option to retreat (the bug is that TripleA doesn't allow you pulling this tactic, or should I say trick, offering retreat in face of only trenches, as long as it is not going to be a stalemate and it happens after the first round of combat).
This game really needs having all the matters involving offence or defence 0, or both, units fully clarified in its notes, as I guess right now its players are just going with what the engine does (are they?), which also means they are going with a couple bugs at least. I believe all matters that need to be clarified, and documented in this game's notes (because the referring rulebook is just talking about transports, that are the only offence or defence 0 units, there), are the following ones:
Is the transport rule that defence 0 units alone are auto destroyed applying to trenches alone too? If yes, then the notes should better inform the players that they can never retreat against trenches alone, hence the trick of taking out the other units to avoid your opponent being able to retreat (the engine is bugged here, so they may need to edit).
Is the transport rule that offence 0 alone against defence 0 alone allows stalemating applying to conscripts alone against trenches alone too? If yes, the notes should better inform the player that they can always retreat before stalemating, for example you can strafe trenches only with conscripts only, while the program doesn't allow you to, forcing stalemate (the engine is bugged here, so they may need to edit).
If stalemated, should the territory be conquered by the attacking units? The behaviour of the program here is that the territory isn't conquered, but I don't believe anybody can know about this aside from testing, so that's just a thing that needs to be decided. While it would be weird having a territory belonging to a different owner then the owner of the trenches in it, I tend to think that if something cannot stop you from staying in a territory, it should not stop you from conquering the same (also think about convoy centres, even though this is not the case of this game).
Is the transport rule that offence 0 cannot attack alone applying to conscripts too? If yes, then the notes should better inform the player that this rules exist both for transport and conscripts, the same way, because this is a totally unsupported element.
I was tired when I wrote my earlier post, and therefore made an error. It's true that if 1 infantry attacks a lone trench, the outcome is an automatic win for the infantry (no option to retreat). But, if the owner of the trench has discovered bunkers tech, that trench now defends on a 1. This means that the attacker no longer gets an automatic victory against a lone trench, but instead must fight the lone trench until it is destroyed or until the attacker retreats or is destroyed. The "retreats" part of that means that lone enemy trenches can be used to teleport infantry--once the enemy has discovered bunkers tech, that is.
An argument could be made that an attacker with zero firepower should be treated differently than a defender with zero firepower. (In fact, that's how the engine is currently set up.) The argument here being that if the defender has zero firepower, and if an attacker with at least a little offensive firepower shows up, there is nothing the defender can do to prevent all his units from being killed eventually. So, you may as well hurry that process along and count all defender units automatically destroyed. But, if I as the attacker show up with zero firepower, there is something I can do to keep all my units from being killed: I can retreat. It would not make sense for the engine to automatically kill off all my units in that instance, because the underlying assumption being made is that I, as the attacker, would want to keep attacking the territory until all my units were dead. That assumption is not logical. I can't think of any circumstance in which an attacker, while making a good faith effort to win the game, would want his firepower 0 units to keep attacking until they were all dead.
Bearing the above in mind, I'd like to reiterate my earlier suggestion. If at the end of a combat round the attacker has no offensive firepower, the attacker should be forced to retreat. Any units which cannot retreat are automatically killed.
