Give First Strike Casualties Option to Fire Back same as Bombard

[beelee]

This would allow more flexibility and maybe not too hard/time consuming to code since bombard works that way already ?

As an option, not a hardwire.

[LaFayette]

Wouldn't enabling such an option effectively negate first strike? In other words, isn't the point of first strike such that casualties do not fire back?

[beelee]

@lafayette the reason i want to use it that way is to allow an extra combat shot for the first rd for certain units but not auto killing the units. It's to simulate a A1 unit getting a A3 for first rd only.

You'd still want it to work the way it does now as well.

[LaFayette]

@beelee I think I am missing how exactly this is intended to work. For bombard, it is less the casualties "get to fire back", it is that they are not immediately removed after being placed into the casualty pool. Would the "first strike casualties that fire back" fire as part of the main defensive roll, or would they roll before other attackers?

It's to simulate a A1 unit getting a A3 for first rd only.

Would you mind clarifying what is meant by 'A1' and 'A3'?

[Cernel]

@beelee said in Give First Strike Casualties Option to Fire Back same as Bombard:

@lafayette the reason i want to use it that way is to allow an extra combat shot for the first rd for certain units but not auto killing the units.

First strike is not "double strike": the units having it won't attack normally, so you don't get any "extra shot": you anticipate your fire.

It's unclear to me what you want to achieve with this option.

[beelee]

@lafayette said in Give First Strike Casualties Option to Fire Back same as Bombard:

Would you mind clarifying what is meant by 'A1' and 'A3'?

Yea so A1 means Attack at 1 and A3 Attack at 3. What i want to do is have a unit that attacks at 1 be able to attack at 3 for the 1st rd of combat only. Right now i have given the A1 unit a "First Strike" shot at A2 to go along with there normal A1 in regular combat.

The First Strike auto kills it's hits so they can't fire back. I want them to be able to fire back.

@Cernel The First Strike fires and then the same unit(s) will fire again in normal combat. This is the "AA code" . Here is an example. First Strike Example.tsvg

The "Wolfpack" unit gives a First Strike that hits at 1 to each of the U-boats. The U-boats then attack again at there regular A2.

Here's an example with Para Units who are not "isSub" units. First Strike Para Example.tsvg

So basically want to have units increase or even decrease there first rd or other rds as well, combat values on attack or defense. But primarily the first rd for what i'm doing. It kinda works as is, just the auto kill a little too powerful for what i want. I'll probably drop to a First strike of A1 instead of A2 to get to A3 for a A1 Unit at this point for a better compromise.

Edit
Would the "first strike casualties that fire back" fire as part of the main defensive roll,

Yes as part of the main defensive roll

[Cernel]

@beelee said in Give First Strike Casualties Option to Fire Back same as Bombard:

@Cernel The First Strike fires and then the same unit(s) will fire again in normal combat. This is the "AA code" . Here is an example. First Strike Example.tsvg

Are you talking about the isFirstStrike or the isAAforCombatOnly "unitAttachment" option? I suspect you are not actually talking about first strike, now.

Anyway, the units in your save-game have both. Why not just avoiding giving the isFirstStrike option to them? I don't understand what I'm missing if anything.

[beelee]

@cernel yea "isAAforCombatOnly" I was confusing them. I need to boost there 1st rd attack value. Hmm ... so if i use "isAAforCombatOnly" it won't auto kill it's hits ? If so, then the solution is already available.

I'll look into this again, but was unable to get it to work originallly

[beelee]

@Cernel yea isAAforCombatOnly still auto kills the unit so it can't fire back.

[Cernel]

@beelee said in Give First Strike Casualties Option to Fire Back same as Bombard:

@cernel yea "isAAforCombatOnly" I was confusing them. I need to boost there 1st rd attack value. Hmm ... so if i use "isAAforCombatOnly" it won't auto kill it's hits ? If so, then the solution is already available.

I'll look into this again, but was unable to get it to work originallly

No, what I understand is that you want a property to give AA casualties the option to fire back.

I seem to understand that what you are calling "first strike" is actually the "targeted attack/defence" (also known as AA fire), not the actual "first strike".

[beelee]

@cernel said in Give First Strike Casualties Option to Fire Back same as Bombard:

I seem to understand that what you are calling "first strike" is actually the "targeted attack/defence" (also known as AA fire), not the actual "first strike".

yes I was using First strike incorrectly. It should be the AAgun. And yes I want an option for AAgun casualties to be able to fire back.

[LaFayette]

@beelee Though, what you are really looking for is attack power to depend on first round or not? Is that independent from AA casualties firing back? Are you actually asking for two things here?

[beelee]

@lafayette Yea I'm using the existing "isAAforCombatOnly" to give a extra first rd combat shot. So for the German Para Unit I have a AA shot at 2 for the 1st rd only and then it's regular combat at attack 1 . This is to simulate a first rd combat value of attack 3.

Edit
right now the AA shot casualties won't fire back. They just die as if they were never there. i want them to be able to fire back

[Cernel]

@beelee Will these "German Para Unit" have the AA fire also if they invade the territory without being air transported? Is that fine with you?

I would imagine, for paratroopers, that you would want a feature that gives additional attack power only if the unit has been actually air transported into battle. This is something I would like myself.
It would also be advisable being possible to define the number of combat rounds this bonus should last, instead of hardcoding it at 1.

[beelee]

@cernel yea right now the Para units only get the bonus if there are only Para units in the attack. Any other unit negates the bonus. So even if they only move 1 space, they are still considered "Air Dropped" for combat purposes.

Edit
yea I wouldn't want it hardcoded. Current AAcombat allows for multiple rounds. These guys rules have the Paras only working as above. I wouldn't be opposed to them working differently as in "Air Dropped" get bonus even with other units present. That can be done with the current supportAttachments though