Total World War: December 1941 3.0.0.6

[Hepps]

@prastle In light of some of my glaring errors... I shall condone the further use of your blasphemous interpretation of English till further notice.

[ubernaut]

@Hepps i know the feeling.

[redrum]

@wirkey said in Total World War: December 1941 3.0.0.3:

@Hepps I came up with an idea about the destroyer/sub issue. I think giving destroyers AA capabilities against subs moving through their sz might be way to balance the two units a bit more. To start with I would only give them those first shots during "overfly" (moving through the SZ) and not during combats. Starting with some value that might make a difference; my idea was for 3/4/5 with destroyer/imp/adv tech and 6 with advanced destroyer.

So I like this idea since destroyers no longer block sub movement. I did some testing and it appears to work properly when setting isAAforFlyOverOnly=true on destroyers. The only limitation is that fly over AA uses the attackAA as the strength so would have to be equal to the combat defense AA of the unit.

Given that we could do something like make destroyer depthcharge have a base strength of 2 for attack/defense/flyover and 3 with improved destroyers and heavy destroyers would have say 4.

[wirkey]

@redrum I think I'd prefer higher values. Starting with 1 or 2 just doesn't make any difference if you have the single DD blocking imo. To be some kind of deterrence it has to have a higher value.

[beelee]

yea been using the DD shoots at the sub when the sub passes through or enters the DDs SZ. I also have it shooting at the sub before combat, so had to lower attack from 1 in 6 to 1 in 10 since it'll shoot twice now if the sub attacks the DD. Once moving in and once before combat.

Not what I wanted but was only way I could get it to work in NCM too.

Anyway, just letting you know that it works.

[Cernel]

@beelee said in Total World War: December 1941 3.0.0.3:

yea been using the DD shoots at the sub when the sub passes through or enters the DDs SZ. I also have it shooting at the sub before combat, so had to lower attack from 1 in 6 to 1 in 10 since it'll shoot twice now if the sub attacks the DD. Once moving in and once before combat.

Not what I wanted but was only way I could get it to work in NCM too.

Anyway, just letting you know that it works.

If the fact that you get shot during Combat Movement in the final destination and moreover in Combat Resolution, as well, is true, that should rather be considered a bug. This should never happen, in any rulesets, and I believe it doesn't happen for regular AA guns, so it should not happen in some other applications.
I suggest you open a bug report, with the savegame.

[wirkey]

three related questions:

1. When was it changed, that if you conquer a (neutral) capital that you get all the money?
2. when was it changed, that once the neutrals are at war, they don't loose all the money
3. what are we supposed to do with the neutrals while they are not at war? I find it very unrealistic if the just kept building their army. But doing nothing doesn't seem right, either.

[redrum]

@wirkey Not sure I can answer any of those given I pretty much never play with politics on and most players don't. But here are my thoughts:

#1/2. I honestly have no idea if that used to be how it worked so I'll have to defer to @Hepps. Might we worth testing 2.7 or 2.8 to see if the behavior there is the same or if something has changed (I'm not aware that anything has). My expectation is however it works now is how it worked in 2.7.7.2.

#3. I think their turns should just be skipped and that they shouldn't build any units. Otherwise they end up with an absolutely massive stack that makes ever attacking them completely insane. That way it may eventually be worth players attacking them to open up the map a bit more towards late game. But again, I don't think neutrals were ever balanced that well or fully flushed out so that its better to just play with politics off.

[ubernaut]

found a bug tried strat bombing Vladivostok got a result of 0 damage and the following error:

Mar 12, 2019 9:43:46 AM games.strategy.engine.framework.GameRunner lambda$start$0
SEVERE: null
java.lang.NullPointerException
at javax.swing.ImageIcon.<init>(ImageIcon.java:240)
at games.strategy.triplea.image.DiceImageFactory.getDieIcon(DiceImageFactory.java:168)
at games.strategy.triplea.ui.DicePanel.create(DicePanel.java:70)
at games.strategy.triplea.ui.DicePanel.setDiceRollForBombing(DicePanel.java:36)
at games.strategy.triplea.ui.BattleDisplay.bombingResults(BattleDisplay.java:165)
at games.strategy.triplea.ui.BattlePanel.lambda$bombingResults$17(BattlePanel.java:408)
at java.awt.event.InvocationEvent.dispatch(InvocationEvent.java:311)
at java.awt.EventQueue.dispatchEventImpl(EventQueue.java:758)
at java.awt.EventQueue.access$500(EventQueue.java:97)
at java.awt.EventQueue$3.run(EventQueue.java:709)
at java.awt.EventQueue$3.run(EventQueue.java:703)
at java.security.AccessController.doPrivileged(Native Method)
at java.security.ProtectionDomain$JavaSecurityAccessImpl.doIntersectionPrivilege(ProtectionDomain.java:74)
at java.awt.EventQueue.dispatchEvent(EventQueue.java:728)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpOneEventForFilters(EventDispatchThread.java:205)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEventsForFilter(EventDispatchThread.java:116)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEventsForHierarchy(EventDispatchThread.java:105)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEvents(EventDispatchThread.java:101)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.pumpEvents(EventDispatchThread.java:93)
at java.awt.EventDispatchThread.run(EventDispatchThread.java:82)autosaveAfterBattle.tsvg

[ubernaut]

tried editing this reply to make the save file easier to spot but my edit got flagged as spam by akismet

[redrum]

@ubernaut Its a known error and has already been fixed in the latest pre-release with this PR: https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/pull/4140. Thanks for reporting it though.

The error is caused by the engine not properly finding and displaying the die image icon for '0' (miss for bombing). It doesn't cause any game problems so you can just close the error and ignore it. It'll be fixed in the next TripleA stable release.

[ubernaut]

oh gotcha i get it thanks

[ubernaut]

am i missing something here or is scrambling/intercept not working correctly for strat bombing?

[redrum]

@ubernaut You can't scramble to intercept SBR. You can only scramble into regular battles. Only the planes already in the territory being bombed can intercept any bombers.

[ubernaut]

@redrum ah thanks!

[Gully]

Hi, I'm back. Cool to see that you are still advancing TWW.

I'm looking for an opponent for By-Forum or By-Email. Who wants to play me? I'm discussing my moves with a friend, so feel free to form a team as well if you want. We both have more Real-Life atm than usual, so the game will be slow. Two moves per week or something like that.

For settings, I prefer with Low-Luck, with Research, without Tech-Sharing, rest is up to you.

[wirkey]

@redrum said in Total World War: December 1941 3.0.0.3:

@wirkey Not sure I can answer any of those given I pretty much never play with politics on and most players don't. But here are my thoughts:

#1/2. I honestly have no idea if that used to be how it worked so I'll have to defer to @Hepps. Might we worth testing 2.7 or 2.8 to see if the behavior there is the same or if something has changed (I'm not aware that anything has). My expectation is however it works now is how it worked in 2.7.7.2.

#3. I think their turns should just be skipped and that they shouldn't build any units. Otherwise they end up with an absolutely massive stack that makes ever attacking them completely insane. That way it may eventually be worth players attacking them to open up the map a bit more towards late game. But again, I don't think neutrals were ever balanced that well or fully flushed out so that its better to just play with politics off.

1. actually I'm not sure if it was that way at all, that you get neutrals money.
2. pretty sure neutrals didn't keep their money. All they had the round war was declared on them, was what they had collected the round before. I think this is what it should be.
3. unless players agree to go a different way: Neutrals collect their income but loose it, if they aren't at war at the beginning of their turn. But they get an inf placed in the capital every 2nd round (or 2 inf in 3 rounds or whatever...)

[ubernaut]

@wirkey maybe i'm missing something, been dabbling with TWW all my game so far i've had politics on and have not seen what you are talking about in 2.7, 2.8 or 3.0. Neutrals are not accumulating PU's or infantry. Have yet to capture or lose a capital yet so cannot speak that in particular.

[redrum]

@Gully Count me in. We should be releasing v3.0.0.3 soon so if you don't mind waiting a few days, I'd say let's do that then start one up. You'll probably want to review all the changes if you haven't already.

[Gully]

@redrum wirkey was faster. You are the final boss again.

Hm, the sub changes. First look and I think it helps the Allies in the Atlantic (British air superiority, also cant combine Kriegsmarine and subs anymore). And in the Pacific, you have to decide whether you want a fleet that controls large areas or one that can poke and do small trades efficiently. Pacific overall will be more interesting I think.