💥 1941 Global Command Decision - Official Thread

Jason Green-Lowe

@thedog I gave the latest version a try for the first time in, oh, I dunno, 2 years? The graphics are obviously much improved, and whatever I was complaining about in the Pacific seems to have been fixed; I can't remember what the problem was.

I played as Germany with all other sides taken by the Fast AI, and found it to be pretty easy -- Leningrad fell on turn 2, Archangel on turn 3, London on turn 6, and the game was over on turn 12. The Soviets did retake Archangel midway through the game, but it didn't matter much because the lend-lease is gone forever once the territory is captured, and they had to strip their southern flank to do it -- so my buddies the Italians made it all the way to Baku in a fit of unexpected competence. I can't remember the last time I was so pleased with an AI alliance partner's performance. The Italians did almost get kicked out of Libya, but after I rescued them once they rebounded and we made it to Cairo together.

As you hopefully can tell from the narrative, I had fun. I particularly enjoyed the whack-a-mole (dodge-a-mallet?) in the Atlantic with the randomly generated submarines and sub commanders; it sets up interesting tactical puzzles each turn and helps simulate the fog of war. It also interacted well with the $1 and $2 sea zones; I'd try to sweep through as many of those as possible on the way to each battle. This felt like it simulated or at least gestured at the idea of sweeping the commercial sea lanes to look for freighters to sink. I would have ideally liked the sea zones to be marked in some way so I know which ones I need to protect as Germany -- my understanding is that you can't actually collect income from enemy sea zones; all you can do is deny the income to your enemy -- but once I start capturing sea zones, I can no longer tell which ones were originally mine (and thus generating income for me and worth protecting at some cost) vs. which ones were originally British (and thus worth taking if I can get 'em for free, but not worth losing a sub over).

My biggest complaint this time was that the Western Allies seemed to have an arrogant indifference to the possibility that they could lose control of the Atlantic Ocean or even the English Channel. While I was building German battleships for several turns, both the UK and US just built loaded convoys; eventually these convoys had to turn around and go back home because there was nowhere safe for them to land; Germany owned the seas, and the UK/US didn't really do anything constructive to try to stop that. They built a few carriers and one or two destroyers, but they didn't concentrate them or save them up or put them in the way of my Sea Lion transports. It was a naval construction program that would have made sense for a 'historical' German opening where the Allies only need mild reinforcements to hunt down a few last submarines, not for a Sea Lion attack where London is going down the drain.

I also wonder if the Infantry-Conscript and Infantry-Trained unit caps ought to be higher than the specialist units like Artillery, Anti-Tank Guns, and Medium Tanks. Having 20 of each unit doesn't really seem to make for a historically balanced army group composition; in real life the vast majority (80%+) of even elite army groups was just regular infantry; if you had 1 soldier inside a tank for every 5 marching on foot, that was a highly mechanized army for the time. Perhaps the ratio ought to be 30 infantry : 20 specialists : 10 tanks, or something like that. I like the way battleships are capped at 5 instead of 10 per stack; something along those lines probably would make sense for the land units as well.

Finally, I didn't entirely follow all of the many steps of each combat, but it looked to me like when armies are attacking airplanes, the armies are forced to use flak; the armies are not allowed to use their regular attack values. This means there is no way to simulate airplanes being 'caught on the ground.' I think if there are only airplanes left in a territory then they should be vulnerable to enemy tanks -- at the very least, they ought to be forced to retreat at the end of combat, rather than supporting a stalemate. Conversely, if 15 infantry and 1 plane attack 15 infantry, the plane will be immediately shot out of the sky by all the flak from the enemy infantry, so the plane isn't doing any good. This feels counterintuitive; having a bit of air support ought to be much better than having none at all. The simplest fix might just be capping AA shots based on the number of air units in the fight, e.g., 15 infantry vs. 1 fighter should only be rolling 1 die per round against the fighter. If there were a specialist unit like flak guns (the way there is for anti-tank guns) then I could see the flak guns each getting a guaranteed roll against a lone fighter, because they're all hunting for the fighter, but infantry is going to be busy with its mission(s) in the mud and trenches; they don't have the time or equipment to go hunting after enemy fighters unless the fighter is currently shooting at them.

Anyway, thanks for all your work on this interesting map. Keep up the good work!

2025-8-29-1941-Global-Command-Decision.tsvg

TheDog

@jason-green-lowe
Thanks for your detailed feedback!

To make the game harder cause your a vet player, turn on Winter, that will be more realistic and harder for the Germans.

All players collect Sea Zone PUs, just a turn later. Yes it almost impossible to remember what you owned last turn, so don't try. Sea Zones work just like land territories, so occupying them denies the enemy the PU and eventually gives you the PU.

Sadly the sea AI is weak, sometimes very weak.

Stacking: We tried a few variants and settled on this version as the player can easily understand it. But I will have a look at your suggestions.

Lone aircraft: Yes don't attack big stacks with lone aircraft. Attack high value stacks & conscripts (not high inf-Trained or Inf-Elite stacks)

Check the manual especially the Air Units page to see the stats in one go.

The whole air mechanics are novel and have their weaknesses, one you have highlighted. I'm open to suggestions.

Play as Japan, for me that's the most tactical and strategic fun.

Jason Green-Lowe

@thedog Thank you! I was playing with winter; it was an interesting added challenge.

That makes sense about the sea zones; thanks for explaining.

TheDog

Latest version v225 ready for download.

In TripleA
Click Download Maps Button
Click Installed tab
Click 1941 Global Command Decision
Click Remove Button
Click Yes button to remove
Click Ok button (Successfully removed)
Click Close (To force the map list to refresh)
Click Download Maps Button
Find & Click 1941 Global Command Decision
Click Install button (be aware, displayed percentage download is not working as intended, have a coffee)
Enjoy!

.
v225

All Land, not Conscript AA v aircraft fire for 2 rounds @ 1:6 chance, was 7 rounds @ 1:12 chance
Destroyer/Convoy_____AA v aircraft fire for 2 rounds @ 1:6 chance, was 5 rounds @ 1:12 chance
Cruiser_________________AA v aircraft fire for 2 rounds @ 2:6 chance, was 5 rounds @ 1:6 chance
Carrier_________________AA v aircraft fire for 2 rounds @ 2:6 chance, was 5 rounds @ 2:6 chance
Battleship______________AA v aircraft fire for 2 rounds @ 4:6 chance, was 5 rounds @ 3:6 chance
Aircraft_________________AA v aircraft fire for 3 rounds, unchanged

Above reduces the chances of aircraft being shot down and removes d12 for AA fire
Thanks to @Jason-Green-Lowe for prompting me to look at the above again.

Scramble To Sea Only - true

.
Current v225 documentation, land & sea AA stats and last page has winter turn on instructions.
1941_Global_Command_Decision_Manual.pdf

.
Link to 1st post that has;
Latest TripleA version
Latest 1941 GCD manual

https://forums.triplea-game.org/topic/3326/1941-global-command-decision-official-thread

wc_sumpton

@thedog

Using this map with version 2.7.15025, last known version where 'centering focus on active player's capital at the start of their turn' works, the German player will center on Sea Zone 113. To center on Berlin-Cen.Germany, that territory, along with the rest of the capital territories will need to be moved to the top of the <map> section.

<map>
	<!-- Territory Definitions 8 capitals & 598 Land & 190 SZ = 796 -->
	<territory name="Berlin-Cen.Germany"/>
	<territory name="Chungking"/>
	<territory name="London-S.England"/>
	<territory name="Moscow-Cen.Russia"/>
	<territory name="Paris-Cen.France"/>
	<territory name="Rome-Cen.Italy"/>
	<territory name="Tokyo"/>
	<territory name="Washington D.C."/>

As for the other secondary capitals, if their order is unimportant, the land and sea zone declaration can be swapped. So, the order in the <map> section would have 8 capitals then 598 land followed by 190 sea.

Cheers...

TheDog

@wc_sumpton
Another rabbit out of the hat!

I thought this was not possible because of multiple capitals for a nation.

Next release will have the above in and links to 2.7.15025
https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/releases/tag/2.7.15025

As this release gives centering focus on active player's capital at the start of their turn.

TheDog

@samurai-jd said in A more challenging AI:

Re: 1941 Global Command Decision - Official Thread

First, for a guy who has played TripleA in the earliest of days and before that all the published versions of the Axis and Allies board games since the 1980s, the GCD map and rules is a true masterpiece. Thank you.

I play solo. Can anything be done to improve the skill of the AI? I have tried both Fast and Hard modes. No matter how I favor the AI (through multiple iterations as either Axis or Allies) the AI is finished by the 7th round. In my most current effort, I start with 2700 units for the Axis and 2400 units for the Allies. Especially when the AI plays as the Allies, I can NEVER get the USA to invade Continental Europe no matter how favorable I set the situation.

I appreciate your time and the incredible game that you have so elegantly created.

Samurai JD

Thanks for your 1st post, thanks for the kind words.

Can anything be done to improve the skill of the AI?

Probably not without some serious engine tweaks or a new AI. Currently the two AIs are weakest at sea.
1941 GCD was probably the first map designed to be played solo v the AI, Im still looking for ways to improve AI play.

I start with 2700 units for the Axis and 2400 units for the Allies.

Does this work? As this means the AI will buy very little as each unit cost 1pu for upkeep/maintenance.

From play test, I know that if you swamp the Atlantic with uBoats both AIs will back off and not try to cross/invade Europe, even though the USA usually has the spare PU to out manufacture Germany.

the AI is finished by the 7th round

Please elaborate on this, for all factions?

beelee

@thedog yea years ago Zim Xero made a solo map for the Pacific. It had quite a few cool things. You might want to check it out if you haven't already. He may have some ideas you haven't considered yet.

"Pacific Theatre" I think it is

TheDog

@beelee
Thanks, I have never played or looked at it.

beelee

@thedog

I did years ago and enjoyed it. He was quite innovative with what triplea could do back then.

TheDog

@beelee
I have played 2 games and got battered, he sets a high bar, next game will be on Easy mode.

Uploaded 11 years ago, 2014-ish, so yes very good for its time, it does have some interesting ideas/concepts.

In the downloads its called Pacific Challenge

To quote Zim Xero
Updated single-player variant of the WW2 Pacific conflict using a modded map created by Triple_Elk, iron__cross, and ComradeKev. This map features AI interactivity, diverging timelines, a unique technology system, nontraditional unit statistics, resources, a 'quick-to-learn hard-to-master' play style, and built-in difficulty selection. Designed for challenging human play as Japan versus the AI.

beelee

@thedog

heh heh yea I remember it had a lot of cool stuff

Might want to add it to your list of triplea games

TheDog

Latest version v230 ready for download.

In TripleA
Click Download Maps Button
Click Installed tab
Click 1941 Global Command Decision
Click Remove Button
Click Yes button to remove
Click Ok button (Successfully removed)
Click Close (To force the map list to refresh)
Click Download Maps Button
Find & Click 1941 Global Command Decision
Click Install button (be aware, displayed percentage download is NOT working as intended, have a coffee, it takes minutes to download)
Enjoy!

.
v230

New capital marker in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean hopefully improves AI USA invasion of Europe (Thanks @samurai-jd )
USA AI ship production now dependant on Industries
Britain AI ship production now dependant on Industries
If Persian Corridor, Baku, Fars, Hamadan, Tehran, Gilan is broken all the Lend-Lease-Depots are removed
If Burma Road, N.Burma, Yunnan is broken all the Lend-Lease-Depots are removed

.
Current v225 documentation, land & sea AA stats and last page has winter turn on instructions.
1941_Global_Command_Decision_Manual.pdf

Suggested stable TripleA version
https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/releases/tag/2.7.15025
.
Link to 1st post that has;
Downloads for new Players
https://forums.triplea-game.org/topic/3326/1941-global-command-decision-official-thread

Samurai JD

Thank you for the replies.

I will download and install the new version of 1941 GCD and test straight away.

I recognize that the AI struggles as units (and additional variables of complexity, such as additional PUs) are increased (in my case, exponentially). However, without USA intervention, the Axis conquers Western and Eastern Europe too easily--even on this elegantly detailed map.

I am no software developer, so I may be naive regarding how the AI may be tweaked to be more aggressive. Personally, I would much prefer to play against an AI whose motto is, "it is a good day to die", over "defend the homeland".

Thank you for listening.

Samurai JD

Samurai JD

Allies, especially UK, better at attacking Western Europe in the most recent GCD iteration.

As one who grew up playing all the WWII board game variations, attacks by the USA on South America made sense only when playing for a PU-driven game--especially if game time was limited.

I respectfully suggest that in this great game of GCD, the USA is wasting time attacking South America in the early rounds and is making the Axis powers (Germany) de facto winners. Can the game be tuned for the USA to ignore South America all together?

Thank you.

Samuria JD

TheDog

@samurai-jd

Can the game be tuned for the USA to ignore South America all together?
No, as the AI is general purpose, and us mapmakers don't have that much control over it.

The Fast-AI motto could be "it is a good day to die", as the Hard-AI attempts to look ahead and evaluate what could happen next.

What you could do is change when say Brazil declares for the USA.
Change line 6582

and line 6601 to
<option name="rounds" value="1"/>

This would make Brazil and other TT, USA owned and the US would not send invasion forces just defence forces.

Bare in mind the US does not get its HQs till round 4, so it is at a big disadvantage till they can be front lined.

Samurai JD

Roger all that.

I have not seen substantive changes in AI play whether the Fast AI or the Hard AI is employed.

On another consideration, I understand that the game can and should be able to morph from the reality of WWII. However, the AI devotes too many USSR resources to defending their eastern flank against Japan at the expense of counterattacking against the Nazis. I have gone so far as to remove factories from east of the Urals and creating a near impassable neutral zone with limited success .

Still Russia defends their eastern borders as the Nazis close on Moscow.

May I suggest that Lend/Lease be active immediately for the USA to provide military resources to the USSR. It would also give the USA something to do besides occupying the eastern Pacific.

Finally, I have made changes to first round of the game to help entice the AI to attack Western Europe and Northwestern Africa.. Naturally I have changed relationships so all major combatants can attack the neutrals.

These thoughts and suggestions are offered humbly and are in no way critical of your game. I have waited a long time for something as elegant and sophisticated as GCD.

Samurai JD.

TheDog

@samurai-jd

I have not seen substantive changes in AI play whether the Fast AI or the Hard AI is employed.

Shame

All 4 Lend-Lease-Depots are active from turn 1. The USA gives 20pu per turn to USSR whilst Vladivostok is USSR, this is automatic.

Other changes you could make are (line 6764)
<option name="placement" value="Archangelsk:Armor-Med"/>
remove 8pu, change it 9pu

and (line 6790)
<option name="placement" value="Baku-Azerbaijan:Armor-Med"/>

ALthough the 2 Armour-Med is minor it forces resources nearer the west and not the east.

TheDog

Latest version v235 ready for download.

In TripleA
Click Download Maps Button
Click Installed tab
Click 1941 Global Command Decision
Click Remove Button
Click Yes button to remove
Click Ok button (Successfully removed)
Click Close (To force the map list to refresh)
Click Download Maps Button
Find & Click 1941 Global Command Decision
Click Install button (be aware, displayed percentage download is NOT working as intended, have a coffee, it takes minutes to download)
Enjoy!

.
v235

All 2HP, Armor-Inf, Armor-Hvy Battleship, Carrier, Carrier-Fleet all cost 2pu for Upkeep/turn, was 1pu (Forgot to do this )
New Infrastructure called Factory add 3pu/turn/Factory can stack upto 2 per TT with Industry-Med or Industry-Hvy
This is to simulate increases in production as the war progressed, as they cost 9pu, that gives ROI after 3 turns. (Can you afford the opportunity Cost?)
Manual p6-7 been updated with above

.
Current v235 documentation, new Factory p6-7 and last page has winter turn on instructions.
1941_Global_Command_Decision_Manual.pdf

Suggested stable TripleA version
https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/releases/tag/2.7.15025
.
Link to 1st post that has;
Downloads for new Players
https://forums.triplea-game.org/topic/3326/1941-global-command-decision-official-thread

TheDog

Apologies the update to v235 failed, but now should be downloadable.