Special bots for playtesting purpose
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Would it be possible to add maps repository even if the balance hasn't tested yet? Why not just adding these maps to category of beta or unfinished, allowing players to download via repository and map owner will be able to change everything without demanding redownloading (Just editing XML).
It would be way easier method for playtesting. Plus hosting requirement would be removed too.
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@Schulz isn't that what experimental is for? That is where I figure my map will go when it gets to a remotely playable stage.
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Its not exactly same. Map owner is unable to change somethings on their own and it also requires other players constantly redowloading and updatings.
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@Schulz How would that be different in a different category? You could still just edit the xml instead of a whole fresh download. Also, what do you mean by hosting requirement? Do you mean on github? I assume that to be in the repository, it has to be on github.
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Because it would be better if playtesters participate other aspects too beside just XML like graphics, game speed, units, adding/removing territories,new units, tech etc... For example if map owner decides to add more territory the map then it just becomes another map not an update. Some might like or dislike its hard to measaure.
Some people are unable to hosting in lobby and without hosting, its not possible easily to play.
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@Schulz I guess I am not sure what you are looking for. It seems like each of your comments is looking for something different.
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I mean beta maps shouldn't be downloaded via repository but instead they should be downloaded via some bots only which preserved playtesting purpose. Thats what would it separate them from experimental categories.
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@Schulz so you want something to keep it up to date for each of the play testers whenever it gets changed?
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Yes, when they open the map on these specialized bots they will see the latest version.
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@Schulz Basically you want an unstable lobby to playtest in like we had for the last 2 years.... which sadly had basically 0 vistors... I have no problem spending triplea money for an unstable lobby if we have testers that actually report to github ... With that being said... the real question here is should we maintain a testing lobby? that no one tests in or refuses to report from? You will never be able to test the unstable in the stable lobby .
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@prastle my interpretation is he wants to playtest the map in the current stable not a prerelease.
What I do is update the repo but not the yaml until I think the changes are ready. That way I don't spam out updating all the time. That can cause some confusion as well if people don't check that the map version is the same though.
I've also noticed it takes a few days sometimes before a bot will use the repo change. It's not instant. Although maybe if you go to a bot and change to that game it does. Haven't tried that. I just noticed it being the previous version when the bot already starts with that game.
Then again my interpretation could be wrong about ... well ... everything
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@prastle I though playtesters just share their opinions with map owners verbally only ,I didn't know about reporting github process. If new pre-release maps are not easily accessable/downloadable via lobby how can playtesting process be occur? They are even people which faces issues downloading games manually.
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@beelee sounds like how we used to share m,aps before the testing lobby sug u continue to do the same then
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I get the feeling something is getting lost in translation.
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@ff03k64 To explain better every bot server costs x per month ... they are all tied to the map repo as @beelee mentioned. We can't just add a map being "tested" that anyone can download and meanwhile possibly screw up a bot server ... example the crashing bot servers of last year ... without it being vetted. That "Map Maker" needs to share it with "friends to test" and or host him self or use the testing lobby...
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Ok. Got it.....
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@prastle So apparently there is way more to this game than i ever thought about. What do the bot servers do as opposed to the lobby? or is the testing lobby just a specific bot server?
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@ff03k64 The testing lobby runs the latest pre release code and has its own bot server. Yes they are 2 sep lobbies. The only way you can achieve what u wish is to "share your map with a friend and private host with both using the same engine and map.
To explain your ? the bot servers host for u. In the old days everyone could host and we never had bot servers -
I think there is some confusion on this thread.
You are welcome to go through the map addition process at any stage of map development and have your map listed in experimental. The map could be totally incomplete, or just a first draft, or polished, you're welcome to do so as early in the process as you would want.
What does that mean, you would have your map in a github repository and listed in triplea_maps.yaml. From there any player could download the map. The download of maps is always the latest. If you change the map, and push those changes to github, anyone downloading again will get those updates. If you change the "version" value in triplea_maps.yaml, then it'll trigger notifications to players that they should update.
When you join games, bots or hosted, you need the map to play. When a host starts a game, you are not downloading the map from the host. Hence, players have to re-download to get updated maps.
If you are using latest features in your map, something that is available for example in 2.3 but not 2.0, then you could use the prerelease lobby (that is still a thing!). To do that, go to engine settings on the main screen after launching the game, testing > lobby URI override, and enter "https://prerelease.triplea-game.org", then save. When you connect to the online lobby next you'll go to the prerelease server.
The prerelease server restarts every time we merge code, potentially zero to a dozen times a day. Every time we merge code, we also do a partial deployment to all production servers which is what triggers bots to update their maps. We can do those on demand too. Interestingly enough, a version update in triplea_maps.yaml is a code merge and in of itself triggers a partial deployment and bots would have their maps updated within about 15 minutes after merging.
Hopefully no map is able to crash bots, we should be safe there, and if not it's something development would be interested to look at to fix.
Hopefully that clarifies a little bit how things are set up.
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@LaFayette I might have to join a lobby just to see what the boots actually do!
