Improving AI
-
@Captain-Crunch "But then we are trapped in the cycle of not having enough players, because not having good AI" - I was following up on his point.
-
Were all of my posts in this thread so bad as to deserve a downvote, whoever it was?
-
@Hepps ya I know I can't believe how tough this AI has gotten from just 1 dev working on it (redrum) despite the criticism from these other 2 lol
But I already said I would wait for more of the priorities for this game to be finished and fixed before I really ask for someone to look into my very easy idea on how to improve the Ai by "learning" from an implemented "WinnersCapturedTerritories" saved file that would help the AI better decide where to attack
A perfect example would be: on WWIIClassic map ...
let's say the AI wants to attack Western Europe or Southern Europe BUT THE TUV and Battle Calculator show that both battles are equal in gain and cost ... so perhaps the AI would use the "WinnersCapturedTerritories" file and see that past winners more often captured Southern Europe over Western Europe and thus you have data that helped the AI choose its target and should therefore be a better decision (the majority of the time)
-
@Captain-Crunch Yup. As a complete layman... my comment was really driven to point out that whatever suggestions we have are likely determined by what our development "team" can commit.
-
@Hepps rofl and by "team" you mean redrum!!
Ya maybe this game needs more of a player base or devs but it still does not take away from the eliteness of this real-time-strategy game!
-
@alkexr ya too bad we can't see who gives down votes eh rofl
Myself I give down votes to trolls hehe. Oh and please stop private messaging me
-
@Hepps I ask for moderator help. I failed at handling this situation.
-
@alkexr I don't think moderation is necessary. Active discussion is to be applauded! Opposing views (within reason) are something to celebrate and are often the cornerstone of great leaps forward in thinking.
Don't let down votes dissuade you from you views. Constructive input to any conversation is the key to any lively discussion.
Sometimes the "lost in translation" factor of using expressly the written word can cause misunderstandings (not to mention when people are trying to express their thoughts in a tongue that is not their native tongue). Not something to loose any sleep over.
-
@Hepps No, that's not what I'm talking about. I don't think Captain Crunch has any respect for me. Without respect there is no discussion, just hurling words at each other. He went all personal against me (said not very nice things about my skills, called me a troll, accused me of downplaying the work of redrum etc.). I conceded to him, multiple times, although I was angry. I thought that would make him stop. It didn't. I pointed these things out to him. That didn't make him stop either. These things together aren't creating a welcoming atmosphere for discussion, creativity, nor for me. Just because I don't respond in kind, doesn't mean I don't feel in kind, if that makes sense. What did I do wrong to let things get so much out of control?
-
@alkexr Nothing. As near as I can tell you have been a prefect gentlemen. What I am saying is don't worry about the content or nature of the criticism. Nothing that has gone on in this thread is over the line.
All I am saying is that if you are going to discuss your opinions openly in a blind forum, you need to take the criticism with more than just a grain of salt. Anonymity makes even the most cowardly brave.
Unfortunately, in this situation other than some mild derogatory statements... there is nothing here to warrant any kind of intervention.
-
@Hepps Unfortunately, this is not the first case I try to avoid a fight against someone like this. The "unfortunately" about this is that I have largely the same experience. My attempts of de-escalation, concessions, are just percieved as weakness, and end up further provoking them. When he said I had no grasp on maths my first thought was to tell him that I originally set out to be a mathemathics researcher, and studied 4 years of mathemathics in university (which I did). I thought that would have just been arrogance, but in retrospect, that seems like the better choice, as much as I don't like that sort of conversation. That would still have been better than what ended up happening. Or how do you think I should deal with this next time? (Assuming it's not obvious right from the first post that I should just ignore it entirely. This one started as a valid conversation.)
-
@Hepps rule #1 should always be "Don't feed the troll" amiright rofl
thankfully I never ever get as mad as alkexr got rofl I love when trolls think they can troll anyone and then ez spend the whole day mad and non-stop rageposting - especially in game chats everyone knows how ez I pwn trolls
-
@Hepps I also suggest you to read the essay Well-Kept Gardens Die By Pacifism, by Eliezer Yudkowsky.
-
@Captain-Crunch Unfortunately Capt. I can't say I agree. @alkexr has been an active member of our community whom has worked hard to add value.
Perhaps I am missing something in the history of the conversation... or perhaps I am missing some aspect of where things went wrong... but I don't view him as a troll.
-
@Hepps I think once I downvoted a post of his, because I thought it was obviously not contributing anything to that conversation.
-
@alkexr I think you mistake my tendency to not want to fight with a dedication to pacifism.
I am not afraid to fight for fear of loosing... I resist fighting for the very reason of what cost my winning will incur on both my foe and myself. I always listen... I talk when I want to... and I fight only when its necessary.
-
@Hepps Read that thing, it's not that long, instead of making bad guesses to its contents
-
@Hepps don't you wish you could see who has more than 1 account here
this may be a shock to you but people troll, act facetious etc. etc. but the best is just keeping them mad and rageposting - its the absolute best and I'm a pro at it -.-
-
@alkexr Then I shall. Lest I make a greater fool of myself more than my assumptions already have.
-
Let's get back on topic.
@Schulz AI development is one of the major features of TripleA and is a priority. Unfortunately it does take a ton of time and labor to do most anything in the code base, it's old and a bit hacky.
I would recommend if there are specific situations where the AI could make a better decision, posting a game save and describing what the AI did and could have done for a better decision could be very useful. Specific spot examples like that we can probably look at specific parts of the code and perhaps improve them..
In theory as well the code architecture tries to support "plug-and-play" AI modules. Namely you can create your own AI and drop it in. It's not done as cleanly as it could be, requires a good bit of programming knowledge, and kinda is a big effort code-wise. Perhaps it's best for now to collaborate to improve the "pro AI".
@alkexr RE: machine learning, the AI could play itself and generate a dataset that way. Unfortunately short term that is not very feasible as the code is in a messy state which makes big changes or additions prohibitive.
