💥 1941 Global Command Decision - Official Thread

[JohnnyCat]

@black_elk said in 1941 Global Command Decision - Official Thread:

For my part the most confusing unit for the asymmetry remains the bunker, especially the bunker at x2. They defeat my mental math completely, and make it so that any time a battle involves bunkers I'm completely reliant on the battle calc to have any sense of the odds. It's just hard to ballbark.

AWESOME !!!! Thanks for your update. And YEA those bunker rules are not intuitive !!! Lol

Well Everyone, I think I can continue now without any huge knowledge gaps as was the case with me over the past few months of learning this game.

When is the release date and/or when can I get a copy of the updated tooltips so that I can expand the regular manual and build this new concise manual prototype using the most updated game?

THANK YOU ALL AGAIN for being so helpful to me and helping me understand this truly great game... ah, I mean "map"

I'm trying my best to make a manual that everyone can understand...

Speaking of which, you all continue to speak in game-code, hahaha, so when you say things like the "CanNotTarget got fixed" I tend to lose focus because I just want to know or have some game-installed guardrails/descriptions that state clearly INF cannot target ships... Ships cannot move on land... and basic rules like that. But nonetheless all your comments are certainly helping me to explain this better to newbies (which is what my updated manual work is really about).

And finally, whichever of you wrote up the part about how the USSR restricted movement of allies into their territory did a SPLENDID job of explaining how the UK, in particular, needs to be cautious to avoid getting forces locked inside the USSR.

So kudos for that because it seems like I will need to provide a few such explanations... such as why when the Gross Deutschland (i.e. a Giant armored column) encounters a lone fighter (which appears to be on the ground) in fact the territory does NOT get taken for a turn and the figher gets away.

Or even more extreme, when that nuke is "CAUGHT ON THE GROUND" (I know it's up in the stratosphere according to you guys, but just like me earlier I doubt newbies will see it that way) and the entire armored division gets wiped out, haha. But now that I have your version of that in my head I will explain that better to newbies...

I hope you see what I mean by intuitive game play. In virtually every other game when land units encounter a lone air unit the land units will win, the territory will get taken and maybe the air unit will escape but maybe not.

But with your explanations I should be able to make a few additional examples and cautions just like your note about the UK units entering Soviet territory.

Cheers

[JohnnyCat]

@thedog said in 1941 Global Command Decision - Official Thread:

As Japan does not have Blitzkrieg (all the extra +1 Atk with paired units like Fighters giving +1 to Bomber-Tac)

Now this is my fault for more or less deliberately not paying attention to too many of this game's details, but I did not even consider "Blitzkrieg / Non-Blitzkrieg countries." I don't even know what that means.

I used to play extremely complex games including the "easier" ones such as Russian Campaign, Third Reich, etc. so I certainly am used to complexity, but lately I have let the ease of these Triple-A games lull myself into a more lazy approach...

And I'm guessing that a large proportion of gamers that pick up this game ARE NOT super nerd/geek types that are comfortable reading 30 pages of manual so I want to do what I can re these manuals to make the game easier to pick up.

So that's background on why I want to add to the manual and such.

But back to your point, I still don't even know why you even mentioned this point about Blitzkrieg...

So what are you trying to say? Why does Japan not have whatever this is?

Are you speaking about the commanders and armor units being able to transport one additional unit each?

Or are you referring to the "blitzkrieg" that allows armor units to move through a tile to another (assuming terrain features do not inhibit that)?

And while you are at it, please tell me what you mean by "(all the extra +1 Atk with paired units like Fighters giving +1 to Bomber-Tac) "

As I have said, I recently came to understand that the meat of this game is actually centered in those details, but I have found it VERY difficult to get a grasp on all those details. Heck I did not even know about terrain features for like a year because none of the other TripleA games I played have that.

So I keep trying to itemize all these little details that I am sure you guys just know like the back of your hand.

So just to summarize what I am asking:

1. What is Blitzkrieg or Non-Blitzkrieg units? What features do they have or not have?

2. What does this mean -->. "(all the extra +1 Atk with paired units like Fighters giving +1 to Bomber-Tac) "

3. Do units gain some "pairing advantage?" I know of only one and that is that one artillery, I think, raises the attack of one infantry by one. Please tell me ALL the pairings that you know of. I don't expect too many right?

4. And I still am not sure just how those commanders work in this regard but I assume it is similar to artillery? So also please tell me what pairings those commanders provide?

5. Do naval units have any pairing advantages ?

6. And what OTHER DETAILS SIMILAR TO THIS in this game should I know about that likely gets overlooked by the LAZY GAMERS such as myself?

--

You guys often say things like "attack on a 3" and I often have difficulty following because I have very different expectations. MY PURPOSE here is to compile ALL the various bonus/detriment details that clearly are critical and must be known in order to play this game effectively.

So please spell things out for a three year old so that I can compile all I need to help everyone starting this game master as quickly and easily as possible

Danke

[JohnnyCat]

@thedog THANK YOU THANK YOU for improving the tooltips.

I had NO IDEA that fighters could not target infantry...

So the fighters shown in this image are essentially useless in terms of the units shown, right? Of course, the tac-bombers are very useful.

Def NOT intuitive... but I can put all that with the Bombers not being able to target naval and make it work...

[TheDog]

@johnnycat
Just in the middle of uploading v180, so a very quick answer.

Blitzkrieg
Remember this page details Blitzkrieg in 1941 GCD terms
Germany+3 others gets +1 attack for Fighters, Armor & Bomber-Tac paired
Japan+3 others do not

[JohnnyCat]

@thedog Got it. That term "Blitzkrieg" is not what I would expect for these pairing bonuses as the term typically means (in my exp) the aforementioned ability of armor units to blitz through multiple tiles

[TheDog]

@johnnycat

1. Blitzkrieg is the +1 Attack bonus for pairing, (note not for Defence) a bit like Artillery in A&A
2. Non-Blitzkrieg are the nations & units that cannot Blitzkrieg
3. The pairing are on UNIT SUPPORTS page, there are 4 of them, each has the word (Blitzkrieg) in brackets
4. As #2
5. HQs are not pairings they can give +1 up to 10 units Attack & Defence, detailed in the tool tip and and UNIT SUPPORTS page
6. No, naval units do not have any pairing advantages, only being with/stacked HQ-Fleet, HQ-Submarine & HQ-Air
7. Terrain, but that is on screen on the status bar

.

Why does Japan not have whatever this is?

A design choice, its xml coded that they dont have Blitzkrieg, simulating their style of warfare. As it was not as sophisticated as the western nations.

.

Are you speaking about the commanders and armor units being able to transport one additional unit each?

No, thats called isLandTransport or isLandTransportable or without the 'is'. I talk in these terms so xml coders know exactly what I mean

.

Or are you referring to the "blitzkrieg" that allows armor units to move through a tile to another (assuming terrain features do not inhibit that)?

No, thats Blitz or canBlitz

.

You guys often say things like "attack on a 3"

Attack on the 3, in A&A & TripleA means roll a D6 and on 1-3 hit/success 4-6 miss, can be written as Atk:3 or A3

[JohnnyCat]

@thedog Just to be clear :

one tac-bomber and 1 inf-trained (or inf motor, anti tank, inf elite) combine and the tac bomber gets a +1 to its attack?

1 armor and 1 inf motor (or tac bomber) combine and give the armor a +1 to attack?

[TheDog]

@johnnycat

one tac-bomber and 1 inf-trained (or inf motor, anti tank, inf elite) combine and the tac bomber gets a +1 to its attack?

No, the Bomber-Tac gives +1 Attack support to only one of these
Inf-Trained, Inf-Elite, Inf-Motorized, Anti-Tank, not Inf-Conscript
They can only be paired once.

.

1 armor and 1 inf motor (or tac bomber) combine and give the armor a +1 to attack?

No, the Armor gives +1 Attack support to only one of these
Bomber-Tac or Inf-Motorized
They can only be paired once.

[Black_Elk]

I also think Blitzkrieg is a potentially confusing term, and prefer Combined Arms to describe these relationships. To me Blitzkrieg is a very particular kind of (German) military doctrine, which uses combined arms and a strategy of continuous advance, likely with units on hella meth to get the job done quicky and on no sleep. Sure the other belligerents saw the advantages of lightning war over the slog of the previous world war, and adapted, but I think it has quintessentially German connotations. Such that Americans or British troops having a Blitzkrieg ability seems kinda off. 'Blitz' on the other hand is a more general purpose term, like even in American Football we have such a thing as a Blitz, where the defenders all rush the line to try and sack the Quarterback. Or adding the definite article "The Blitz" I just think of civilians holed up in the Underground, waiting for the air raid sirens to stop. It's a bit of a mixed bag for a term hehe, but in A&A "Blitz" is a technical descriptor for a particular kind of attack movement, specifically for the tanks which move across 2 spaces.

For the thing about Fighter aircraft not being able to hit infantry unless there are combined arms in the mix, this makes a certain sense. Like I can imagine well trained Infantry units scattering and heading for the tree lines, but also, every WW2 movie I've ever seen has that shot with a Fighter flying low to strafe a column of Infantry units. Like that shot is in ever flick pretty much. For my part I think if one wanted to include this idea that infantry would have an easier time hiding than say a heavy ass tank that weighs several tons and can't hit the floor like soldiers might, that this could maybe be achieved by focusing only on Elites. In other words Conscripts and reg Infantry could be killed by the fighters, but the Elites are maybe dodging under the treelines - the columns all camouflaged up with nets and decoys. Like you'd still end up with some weird stalemate situations there probably, but it wouldn't make the primary fodder unit for most nations un-hittable by the primary air unit. For me that's more of a practical mechanical consideration, since right now I struggle to justify air purchases over other units which provide a more reliable hitpoint, or more consistent attack/defense power.

There are niche instances where it makes sense to buy fighters, say if the territory is already at the cap, or where you can overwhelm a player that doesn't have sufficient production capacity to spam fodder units. For example Japan can smoke China pretty easily with massed air provided they use their Air HQ as well for the bonus, using a tactic I call the Air Blitz (another kind to the whole use of Blitz for everything hehe) but basically that's a situation where naked Air keep attack to kill ground that are unlikley/unable to hit back, which is something that can be done to pretty good effect here, though again it's a bit asymmetrical by Nation.

For combined arms with the Tactical Bombers, one issue there for pairing multiple unit types is whether/how the player can determine which unit will actually get assigned the bonus. For example in A&A all the units effected just Hit at 3s so it's easy to see how a bonus to one or the other might not really matter if multiple unit types are capable of receiving the bonus. But if some units have targeting, or have different hits at values, then it's a consideration. Like it might make more sense to assign the bonus to an Anti Tank unit with a chance to hit at a higher value, or with an opening strike type action, as opposed to say some other unit type that can't do that stuff. I think for order of battle type things it'd difficult because the battle screen moves so quickly and it's hard to tell which units are being effected by other units.

Also when each nation has different unit types available, having all these very specific targeting actions means that players not only have to be familiar with their own unit roster, but also all the opponents unit rosters, in order to fully appreciate what's going on. So for example if Allies have one type of ship the Destroyer, but Japan has a supped up version of the same, the player needs to understand how both work before they can make a considered attack plan. That information is hard to parse in advance, or from tables. It's even hard to tell from fighting actual battles if you're only seeing one side of the equation. The player really almost needs to have a purchase menu and go through the motions with each nation to grasp what's going on in it's totality.

One possibility would be to show a complete purchase screen that shows all available unit types (including tech advance stuff, or stuff specific to only certain nations) but to have the units blanked out if not available. So for example if there is such a thing as a super sub on the board, that the player can quickly see the TUV attack/defense or bring it into the calc and get the quick read. But then the purchase screen would basically just be the unit notes all over again, and probably too much information. If the idea is for the player to control an entire team, it's more likely that they'll see the little differences, but if they only control a single nation, you could get the same sorta thing for teammates, where the player just doesn't really know what makes one ship type different for some nations. HQs are like this in the opening rounds of the game. If you are playing as a power that has them you can see what's going on, if not, it can be very confusing to understand how they work. I learn by using the stuff, so the only way to really figure it out was to just keep playing different Nations until it started to click, but it's hard to cross ref or use the experience of one player nation to inform how stuff is going to work for another. For examaple switching from Germany or Japan which have HQs on their first turn, to USSR or USA which don't have them. Probably the HQs need like a whole page in the manual just to themselves. My shorthand is basically without HQs I'm probably going to lose whatever battle, so a lot of the early game is just delaying/stalling tactics till them come online. Or if Axis to race early and make the most of them before Allies catch up. A Nation like Anzac isn't even really functional until they get their roster expansion, so it's also hard to compare the larger nations on either team to the smaller ones on team Allies.

For manual drafting advice, I'd say M3 off the factories and M3 in the water for Cruisers and Destroyers would be worth highlighting. It took me a long time just to figure out why I was able to move some units so far, and others not far enough hehe. The terrain for M2 units basically. I still think it's hard to parse movement changes like that, and think it would be somewhat simpler if terrain didn't effect movement at all, but only attack/def power. Right now a lot of terrain features feel too similar in terms their effects to me. Forest and Mountain and Urban I guess, since those are the most common and the descriptions have very a similar read. I think Urban to me suggests that it would be easier to move armored units rather than more difficult, but I also just have a hard time envisioning such huge regions as particularly urban. Like I guess if everything is all bombed out and bridges and roads are destroyed it makes sense that it's hard to get around, say Stalingrad where everyone is fighting in rubble, but then I also think of it more like the roads still being in alright repair. Or where there are population centers capable of rebuilding the stuff and roads that don't flood out or freeze for half the year. Or some desert stretch where sand grinds the gears. For me movement adjustments are the most challenging to get the head around, because often I can't really tell until I try to move something that the movement won't work. Trying to parse the unit caps is similar, but there's more give there at 10 units, where a terrain -1 movement might be more of a surprise, and all or nothing for maneuvering stacks with the tank tow. That said, I think the movement stuff from Rail is the single best thing this game has going, since that stuff really changes the emergent playpatterns and the ability for players/AI to clap back across a pretty good distance, in ways that keep me on my toes. The m3 movement I think creates a nice push/pull dynamic, and makes logistics just foggy enough that I'm always second guessing whether I can actually hold vs enemy counter attacks on the follow up turn. I love that stuff!

Anyway, just more rambles, not sure how useful my impressions are really, cause I've been at a while so I'm probably too familiar to see the forest from the tress for some stuff, but I can remember having some issues with the learning curve in those areas.

Nice work all! Keep it hummin'

ps. here's another solo start to J3. Similar thrust but going after the Pacific Allies instead of the Brits in India. I just bought a couple extra minor factories to shore things up and set big wall down in the south Pacific with the fleet. Felt pretty solid. I had like one big TUV trade vs China but I think they're about spent now. Brits gave me some trouble and almost took Bangkok after we whiffed in Lower Burma, but all and all pretty smooth sailing. Flexing against the Allies with the Japanese fleet I'm not sure there's anything Anzac or USA could do to threaten an approach, or an attack that wouldn't have them getting wiped by a secondary fleet, so they just sorta break and run away.

2024-9-4-1941-Global-Command-Decision J3.tsvg

[TheDog]

@black_elk
As always some good insights, I will digest and post, maybe at the weekend.

Re: Post about better AI.
Ebbe and I have been working on a new version of Shogun Advanced, its almost ready. It has Get Impending Winner routine, this is where the isAI is used to change the political relationship of neutral Clans to War to try/Get Impending Winner.

For GCD I think I have given the AI a lot of help already, with free Industries & units, and programmed placements, but I will look again.

[TheDog]

Latest version v180 ready for download.

WARNING: This version is NOT compatible with your old saved games, so finish them before upgrading.

In TripleA
Click Download Maps Button
Click Installed tab
Click 1941 Global Command Decision
Click Remove Button
Click Yes button to remove
Click Ok button (Successfully removed)
Click Close (To force the map list to refresh)
Click Download Maps Button
Find & Click 1941 Global Command Decision
Click Install button
Enjoy!

v180
Thanks Cernel for the HQ icon changes & renaming suggestions.

• Swapped Gemany HQ-Army Manstein, was Rommel. (thanks Black Elk). Rommel icon is in 1941_global_command_decision\map\units\Germany\NotUsed
• Swapped Italy HQ-Army icon Bastico, was Roatta (thanks Black Elk)
• Swapped Italy HQ-Fleet icon Angelo Iachino
• Swapped Italy HQ-Air icon Rino Corso Fougier (BW with AI colorized)
  .
• Renamed Chernihiv to Chernigov
• Renamed Kyiv to Kiev
• Renamed Prinsk to Pinsk
• Renamed Prypriat to Prypiat
  .
• Tool Tips now includes canNotTarget (thanks to johnnycat) Some are now color coded to aid the player
• Manual update politics sheet (thanks to johnnycat)
  .

---

Link to 1st post that has;

• Google Drive download link
• Latest TripleA version
• Latest 1941 GCD manual

https://forums.triplea-game.org/topic/3326/1941-global-command-decision-official-thread

[Black_Elk]

First run for the new one. I did Japan again and took it half a dozen rounds.

Similar to the last game we went for the quick crush on Chunking and then tried for the easy pickups vs the Dutch islands. I opted to gun for Hawaii as well this time, just to get ahead of things. The Chinese had a nice counter attack going since we had to give up ground to swing heavy vs the south, but eventually we yo yo'd them into a trap along the coast to destroy their HQs with the amphib and air support. I did the Impala swing to snap up Ceylon and get on India. We doubled back of Hawaii the same round to start putting the heat on New Guinea. Still holding steady at 20 VCs, but I think Axis are about to round the corner. FastAI Germany just held Moscow through the round. I thought we might take the Win at Sydney but then Pacific Allies clapped back a bit and sank my pocket fleet. Will probably have to be Cairo or Baghdad instead for the VC kill.

Fun campaign for a sprawler hehe

2024-9-5-1941-Global-Command-Decision J6.tsvg

[JohnnyCat]

TOBRUK

So I'm sitting with a new player and he looks at the map and decides he wants to take Tobruk

And he, reasonably, thinks to bring in the Malta-based air units to help and then to add to the defense of Alex/Cairo

So I asked him to bring up the tool tips to ensure that said fighter could help:

Since I DO NOT see any RED BOLD or otherwise notable tooltip restriction I assume that this Fighter COULD attack this infantry... EDIT - This was NOT using the newest game so perhaps the new game has this???

But then I recall hearing a rumor told to me by a cat that was cruising by one evening who told me about another rumor about fighters not being able to target land units or inf or something ...

Anyway please let me know if this fighter can or cannot be effective here and if not, are you doing anything in the tool tips to ensure that this knowledge is readily available ???

Cheers

[JohnnyCat]

@thedog GREAT NEWS !!!!!!!

[JohnnyCat]

@johnnycat CONTINUING ON with my young friend's indoctrination into GCD...

So we conclude that fighters cannot attack ground units (which makes no sense to me but I'm guessing you all have a reason that does make sense) he decides to use the tac bombers.

The ODDs of victory for Tobruk and the neighbor are 95%

Sounds great right?

But two seconds later the attacking force on Benghazi IS WIPED OUT

And everything in Tobruk is ALSO WIPED OUT except the attacking Tac-Bomber which limps back in total confusion and embarrassment, lol.

Does any of this make any sense ? NOTE: we ALWAYS select LOW LUCK.

Thanks

[JohnnyCat]

FAST or HARD

And I am not talking about my Girl Friend

Why when you folks post games you seem to use the AI FAST and not the AI HARD???

What is the reason for this choice?

[JohnnyCat]

@thedog Well I upgraded to v180 but despite multiple restarts I cannot seem to get any previous game saves to work nor start a new game

Am I doing something wrong?

[TheDog]

@johnnycat
v180 does have colored Tool tips, v175 does not

.
Fighters cannot kill Inf-Trained, etc because Fighters would look for/target high value assets and not waste their ammo on infantry that they would probably have little to no effect on. This map is trying to be a simulation of WW2.

Question for you, why are using Low Luck? Try it without. I have never played with Low Luck, for me Ordinary Luck its part of the fog of war.

FastAI is faster and appears more aggressive than slower HardAI. FastAI plays more like a human would, but its your choice.

Am I doing something wrong?

No. (regarding try to load a saved game)

Regarding loading old saved games, you cannot, my bad, I will update the v180 post.

The reason is because 4 territories got renamed and they dont match your older saved games.
Either reload an old version of the map v175 or start a new game.

[wc_sumpton]

@johnnycat said in 1941 Global Command Decision - Official Thread:

And everything in Tobruk is ALSO WIPED OUT except the attacking Tac-Bomber which limps back in total confusion and embarrassment, lol.

Bad dice. With low-luck, and you stated 1 tac survived, it would be 1 dice at 5 vs 1 dice at 2, with the following round being 1 dice at 4 with the loss of 1 infantry. If the tac is taken out during the a round of AA combat, then both attacker and defender are 1 dice at 2 until the loss of an infantry.

So, bad dice.

Cheers...

[JohnnyCat]

@thedog I APPRECIATE THIS answer very much.

you explained the fighters with logic I assumed you had - and I don’t disagree.

But because I feel most people will assume otherwise, as I did over the past year, I PLAN ON ADDING YOUR EXPLANATION to the manual !!! So thanks for spelling that out. With that explained in the manual I’ll certainly feel better about how newbies will come across such a scenario. Because THEY WILL expect those fighters to behave as in a Hollywood film lol

SIMILARLY ABOUT HARD AI vs FAST AI

Unlike what you said, and again I’ll state I don’t disagree, I feel most newbies will come to this game/(sigh, I mean “map”) with the expectations that HARD is better than FAST

And once again your explained logic is something I feel is required to be In The manual.

MOVING ON

I totally DISAGREE, however, WITH YOU about LOW LUCK. Well… maybe I do. And well maybe not.

Initially i might say something like “I’m not interested in wasting my time with any game where 2+4 sometimes equals 6 but some times equals 6 hundred and 47!!”

“No thank you” I’d go on, “I want to know that when my armored division comes upon your sword-wielding, one-eyed conscript and his three legged donkey I FREAKING WIN. “

I can’t imagine choosing the frustration that would come from playing a game with such depth and complexity as this and then introducing extreme randomness.

BUT THEN AGAIN I suspect that I know why you choose low luck and I’m starting to agree:: : You guys must be board with this game by now cause you know it so well haha

Seriously I think I understand that because now I can’t lose to the AI no matter what side I play so I too keep trying to spice it up. Only instead of adding randomness to dice rolls I prefer to make it interesting by adjusting the unit balance or introducing fantasy things like giving the Germans a nuke early or shifting the entire Italian force away from Russia or setting up an early German conquest of South America.

In any case, once again I feel we all benefit from your response so again my sincere thanks

FINALLY PLEASE REREAD WHAT I SAID

I CANNOT GET THE GAME v180 TO WORK

The territory name change makes great sense about saved games BUT as I said I cannot get a new game to work EITHER

I posted those images because that’s all I have to go on.

I’m using Macs, ofc.

Cheers
Johnny