Iron War - Official Thread

Black_Elk

I'm kind of a capricious overlord, so I generally save all my cash and resources for the big 3 hehe. In the past I would usually assign Finland, Iraq, Iran, and Thailand to the AI, so it's kind of a new thing for me to take control over them.

I haven't been bombing much lately, I tend to save that as a mop up tactic once it's a forgone conclusion. Or occasionally in retaliation for an AI bombing run. It still feels like a bit of cheap shot, though I suppose with the boost maybe the AI can handle it hehe.

I usually buy the SS units little by little with Germany, but with Italy for whatever reason I will often let them stack up and then spam colonials at the end. They're definitely worth the cost. Cheap hitpoints are always a good buy haha. Not sure why but usually I'll go with magnified builds, like a bunch of aircraft, or mech or whatever at one time, rather than building up piecemeal. Buying infantry/art and air for several rounds saves on the resources, so when I finally unleash I usually have a fair amount banked to support the play. Since nothing is worse than grinding to a hault mid-move.

Didn't do much fuel or cash exchanging that time, but might give it a go on the next run. Each time I start I new game I think about a new coordination plan, but then a lot of the time when the purchase screen comes up I'll forget it, and default to greedily spending the whole pile haha.

Ps. Just did a quick first round under the same conditions, except this time I sent everything I could to Japan, to see how strong we could make them. Here they got 25 PUs from Germany, 25 from Italy and 10 fuel from Iran. This time we aim to keep Tokyo haha
0_1495491779515_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Japan 1.tsvg

When playing the AI I often give myself over to last minute, impulsive and reckless purchasing haha. Like just there with Japan, I'm sure I had a different thought last round, but sometimes its like, 'hey, lets scrap all that, go ahead and buy 9 fighters, why not!' lol
0_1495493519466_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Germany 3.tsvg

Looks like the tide is turning against us. A bit of overreach and some assassin strikes by KNIL set us back hehe. Probably should have broken Sumatra right off the bat. But fun stuff!
Here we are in 43...
0_1495498479235_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Germany 7.tsvg

Anzac AI sent the pride of the IJN to the bottom of the Sea! haha Brilliant!
0_1495500905208_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Japan 8.tsvg

@beelee For sure dude! You know how I like to go down, in a blaze of glory heheh

redrum

@Black_Elk So the error is "java.lang.OutOfMemoryError: Java heap space" which means TripleA ran out of memory. You probably want to try increasing the memory to avoid that.

The rest of the "WARNING" messages just indicate the AI tried to do something that wasn't possible. This won't cause any errors but just negatively impacts the AI's performance. It appears most of them have to do with the AI trying to move units that it didn't have enough fuel to move.

redrum

@Frostion Umm I'm not aware of any errors related to changing territory PU values and haven't seen that error message before. Can you post the full error log and a save game to reproduce it?

Frostion

@redrum
I used the last posted savegames of Black_Elk, and loaded it with the latest version of Iron War. Then I just went into history mode to look at round one, and this triggered the error.

I can post the full error tomorrow if you want.

Edit: In would imagine the error could be produced by starting a new game with the map option "Balkan states are German" on. This will change the five Balkan territories' PU value during round one. Then in round two one might look at history and trigger the error. But this is just my first thought.

beelee

@Black_Elk
seems as if you're having so much fun it should almost be illegal : )
well... unless you're in Cal or AK or WA, Oregon... heh heh : )

My bad sorry folks : )

redrum

@Frostion You're correct. I easily reproduced using the setting in round 1 and there is a bug with the game history and changing territory production value. Here is the issue to track the bug: https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/issues/1743

Frostion

@all
Before I report this as an issue, I would like to hear if someone has any ideas about what is going on. When playing as Germany and building a carrier in round one, placing it in the North Sea bordering West Germany, the engine seems to not let me choose what air units to move out onto the new carrier. I would like the 3 fighters to move out onto the carrier, but the engine only seems to let me move 2 air units (1 fighter and one bomber). Why is there no option to choose the 3 fighters instead?
This happens regardless of any of the units have moved around on the map in combat or not.

Here are some screenshots of the problem:

Here are the units:
Fighter
<option name="attack" value="5"/>
<option name="defense" value="6"/>
<option name="movement" value="4"/>
<option name="carrierCost" value="1"/>
<option name="isAir" value="true"/>
<option name="canScramble" value="true"/>
<option name="maxScrambleDistance" value="1"/>
<option name="canIntercept" value="true"/>
<option name="canEscort" value="true"/>
<option name="canAirBattle" value="true"/>
<option name="airAttack" value="6"/>
<option name="airDefense" value="6"/>

Bomber
<option name="attack" value="7"/>
<option name="defense" value="2"/>
<option name="movement" value="6"/>
<option name="carrierCost" value="2"/>
<option name="isAir" value="true"/>
<option name="isStrategicBomber" value="true"/>
<option name="bombingMaxDieSides" value="3"/>
<option name="canIntercept" value="true"/>
<option name="canAirBattle" value="true"/>
<option name="airAttack" value="2"/>
<option name="airDefense" value="2"/>
</attachment>

Carrier
<option name="attack" value="2"/>
<option name="defense" value="2"/>
<option name="movement" value="2"/>
<option name="fuelCost" value="Fuel" count="1"/>
<option name="hitPoints" value="2"/>
<option name="isSea" value="true"/>
<option name="carrierCapacity" value="3"/>

redrum

@Frostion So it let's you pick 1 fighter and 1 bomber for a total of 3 carrierCost but won't let you select 3 fighters which would be the same cost?

Edit: Does it automatically just select 1 fighter and 1 bomber when you choose "2"? Or are you doing something to specifically select those? My hunch is that it is just randomly selecting air units with carrierCapacity and there isn't a way to select specific air units.

Edit2: If you remove the bomber from the territory, does it then allow you to select 3 fighters?

Frostion

@redrum

"So it let's you pick 1 fighter and 1 bomber for a total of 3 carrierCost but won't let you select 3 fighters which would be the same cost?"
Thats right.

"Does it automatically just select 1 fighter and 1 bomber when you choose "2"?"
Yes, but I cannot choose 3 in any way.

"Or are you doing something to specifically select those?"
No, there is no option to choose unit type.

"If you remove the bomber from the territory, does it then allow you to select 3 fighters?"
Yes, then I can click my way to 3 units

redrum

@Frostion Alright, I understand the problem. We really need to add the ability to select which air units to move to carrier not just randomly select them. This probably hasn't come up much since most maps only have 1 type of air unit that can land on carriers. Can you go ahead and create a github issue for this?

As a workaround, you could consider changing the ruleset to make players land air units in the sea territory you are placing the carrier. I personally prefer that rule to the deploying of planes from an adjacent land territory to the carrier.

Frostion

@redrum OK, I will post an issue

Black_Elk

Yeah this has been going down since the first game I played. I think I mentioned it in my initial posts, though in that instance it was the German air transport that was giving me the issue.

Also sometimes you will run into kinks if two coastal factories border the same sea zone (like Japan and Manchuria for example), where you have to make sure you place in the right order to get the proper fighter prompt for the carrier.

My eventual solution to bombers on carriers was just to make sure I landed them in a different territory than the one I planned to build the carrier from.

Would be sweet if that one got a fix.

Black_Elk

possibly related...

Saw something in this Solo Japan game of Iron War, where the US AI in round 3 placement phase attempts to place 2 bombers and 1 dive bomber in the Hawaiian sea zone, only to have them crash into the water because there is no landing spot available on the carrier.

So basically AI just threw 78 PU's into the ocean to no purpose hehe. I think I've seen this happen before with the AI attempting to place air transports in the water too. Often the AI's turns happen so fast it is hard to tell when it happens, but there is definitely TUV lost in the water mysteriously.
0_1495644060355_Elk Japan vs AI Allies US bomber placement on carrier error.tsvg

redrum

@Black_Elk There is definitely an AI bug there. It appears that the issue is the AI runs out of resources to be able to build all sea units after purchasing a few so only can afford air units in the Hawaiian SZ. It actually realizes there isn't enough carrier room but there is a bug that even though all air units have a 0% chance of being purchased it still selects one of them randomly! Essentially, this is just a rare edge case that has to do with not handling when only air units are available to purchase based on resources in a SZ and none of them have carrier space. This pretty much never happens on 99% of maps since they have cheap sea units like subs or destroyers that would always be available.

Black_Elk

@redrum Right on. I was wondering what it could be. Managing steel consumption for ships can be a real challenge, so I can see how the AI might botch it occasionally. Even the lowly patrol boat is a steel hog hehe.

Well, for the glory of the Empire I kept it going until Axis economic victory at the end of the 15th round. I was surprised it took so long, since Japan got pretty rich gobbling up Russia. At this point in 1947, India is like the lone hold out standing in the way of complete Japanese domination of Asia.
0_1495654071250_Elk Japan vs AI Allies Japan 16.tsvg

redrum

@Black_Elk This is now fixed with PR: https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/pull/1752. Please test once that is merged. I saved the game right before the US turn and used that to reproduce the bug and then verify the AI doesn't do it after the change: 0_1495673931642_test.tsvg

Hopefully, no more throwing away TUV into the ocean

redrum

@Frostion Thanks for opening the issue: https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/issues/1751. I'll take a look and see how much effort that would be to implement.

Also after fixing the bug @Black_Elk reported, I ran a test game with all Fast AI for 17 rounds with no errors and it was pretty much dead even on TUV.

Black_Elk

Just started my first game with the pre-release TripleA-1.9.0.0.4385

Playing a German solo vs the Hard AI for the Majors and Fast AI for the minors. Happy to report the fighters are now placing on the carriers as they should, and haven't had any issues yet with the bombers or air transports. Also enjoying the save after non combat feature, since I'm constantly forgetting AA guns and such, it's pretty convenient. I gave the AI Allies each a 20% income boost and they're fighting pretty well so far. I figured it would probably be smart to try and win the battle of the Atlantic, so I've been positioning for a G4 Sea Lion. Here it is in later 1941 on the eve of the Invasion of England...
0_1495874749382_Elk Germany vs Hard AI x20 percent income G4.tsvg

A few rounds later in 1944. The Soviets have just crushed Finland, but are starting to fold up at the center after I launched an amphibious invasion with German mech to take Siberia. Meanwhile Italy has just pushed through into Stalingrad, so it seems the tide may be turning on the Eastern Front at long last. On the other side of the globe Japan still has quite a bit to contend with, as the Allies now have like 30+ fighters roaming about in the backyard hehe. They were all ganging up at Midway for a hot minute, but just got ALSIB'ed over to the Soviet Far East, where they're sure to cause Axis some headaches. Pretty fun so far!
0_1495880153032_Elk Germany vs Hard AI x20 percent income G10.tsvg

redrum

@Frostion While fixing the choosing air units for newly built carrier issues, I decided to tackle another issue that has been around and reported for a long time regarding being able to select which factory you use when multiple factories are adjacent to a sea zone.

Here is the PR fixing the issue and once its merged folks can test the functionality: https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/pull/1766

Hepps

@redrum Glad you caught that. That issue has in fact been around for a long while.

And though you can work around it... a permanent solution would be a great step forward.