Is TripleA finally dead
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On December 2, @TheDog opened an issue about messed up visuals when running "1941 Global Command Decision" with TripleA version 2.7.15273.
TripleA is a visual game. If the map displays territory ownership wrong, then the visual information given to the player is bad. If the 'Players' tab is wrong, then the player is being given bad information. There were many errors, but all these errors could be traced back to the failure of the xml not loading correctly.
@TheDog closed that issue on December 18 at the request of admin and developers and reopened a new issue with the same visual problems.
There have been plenty of releases since @TheDog' issue and none were directed at fixing these visual problems. And as of version 2.7.15334 released on January1 TripleA will not load. There have been 4 releases since and TripleA still does not load.
New releases and the game won't load. New releases that display bad information and throws false error messages.
Why fix it, the engine is broken, the display is false. The information shown to the player is incorrect.
TripleA is dead. Does anybody care?Cheers...
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Yep I think so.
None of the devs play the game. Ran off all the ones who did. It's all about power and control. They dgaf about the game.
Too bad
@redrum was the last dev who actually played the game. The Axis and Allies site by @djensen47 gonna take a hit too, as all the veteran members use it.
Pathetic
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@beelee said in Is TripleA finally dead:
as all the veteran members use it.
Hopefully they stay on 2.5.
Cheers...
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Not the first time, we are under this impression during the last years. It's a pain, indeed.
And, @beelee , we have discussed that before, and it is as you say.
I am not sure about sticking to 2.5, however. What do you guys think has been the latest 'working' 2.7-prerelease?
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@panther
My 2p is use 2.7.15025 as suggested by @wc_sumpton here
https://forums.triplea-game.org/topic/4223/what-version-and-why/13This gives Capital centring and all the speed and benefits of 2.6 & 2.7
https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/releases/tag/2.7.15025I have been using 2.7.15025 since wc_sumpton post, dated (25 Nov 25) , for AI testing, since it was so close to my prior test version 2.7.15032 it is stable enough for me.
Occasionally I dip in to the latest release, but keep going back to 2.7.15025
Get it here
https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/releases/tag/2.7.15025 -
@thedog Thank you, however the issue regarding the providing of source code only had been fixed quickly. I am currently using 2.7.15287 and wonder if I could safely use a newer version / if we could recommend a newer version.
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@panther
From me no, I have also been using 2.7.15256 but that is older than your version, so no help. -
As @TheDog has started, 2.7.15025 is the last version which had the 'new' centering worked.
If the 'broken' centering does not bother you then 2.7.15256 would be my next best guess.
2.7.15274 and 2.7.15275 had fatal error crashes withERROR o.t.game.client.HeadedGameRunner - Wrong thread (not Event Dispatch Thread).
2.7.15276 has the blank screen for AI players. Even though the screen seemed to 'catch up' on human players the AI player screen never seemed quite right. Did the 'fix' for 2.7.15273 create this screen issue? I don't know. As @TheDog has documented any AI game rum on the engine past version 2.7.15256 is problematic. What happened between 2.7.15256 and 2.7.15273 is unknown because the 17 changes were not released.
There have been so many releases since that gap that the root cause to this problem may be buried.
From 2.7.15326 until 2.7.15330 will run 'okey' as long there are no AI players starting the game. These issues, 'bad chance rolls', 'not enough resources', 'can't place', seem to happen only with a new game because a saved game plays just fine. @TheDog has even reported that the game breakingERROR o.t.game.client.HeadedGameRunner - Wrong thread (not Event Dispatch Threadhas returned.
This 'problem' has been ignored, and now 2.7.15333 will not load with more releases burying this.
Major problems need to be fixed. Releases should be halted until then. Otherwise TripleA might as well be buried, the engine has been broken since the beginning of November, maybe even longer. I know I'm tired of seeing and reporting the same issues over and over again. And I think @TheDog might be tired of it also.
And let's not talk about what improvements map makers are asking for, for maps like "North Africa" or "Stalingrad".
It's time to shut down development, kick it to the curb and let it die.Cheers...
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Ok, so thank you @wc_sumpton for your substantiated recommendation , and thank you, @TheDog , too.
So it seems like 2.7.15025 or 15256 might be the best pick, at least to those who care about a 'reasonable' working AI.
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@LaFayette @frigoref
Drawing your attention to this thread, above will be a hard read.
TLDR you are losing the goodwill of your testers.Please fix some of the outstanding 2.7 issues.
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Thanks @thedog for reaching out to us!
Let me first apologize for the current disruption of the user experience. We are trying to improve TripleA and as it is still big and complex those kind of side effect might arise.
In addition, we are all very restricted with the time we can spend and appreciate any kind of support we can get so we can focus on the code. This includes reminders on major issues (including links to them) if they seem to have been forgotten about, prioritizing the issues listed on GitHub or simply summarizing a long thread discussion to the core information required for a developer to act on.
However, a supporting manner would be better than flaming about issues - even though the frustration might be high. TripleA is definitely NOT finally dead! (on the contrary, I am quite sure we can release 2.7 this year)PS: Putting such a statement / thread in a forum might even prevent new players to start playing and I assume no one here would like to see that happening.
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@wc_sumpton Which issue of yours are you referring to?
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13915 Which is the same as 13962. This problem has caused one warning message to be removed, 13961 and a PR to remove another warning message 13965.
My first question why are "Warning" messages being removed? They don't cause a game to crash, they provide information that there may be something in the xml causing these problems. PR 13961 should be rolled back.
Issues 13915 and 13962 are describing a loading problem with a new game where the first or all players are AI.
Removing "Warning" messages does not fix this problem.
A saved game always plays correctly. If the first player is not AI then the game plays correctly. If any player is not AI, then the game will correct its display at that players turn, and the game will play normally. @TheDog documented this, and the issue could be traced back to release 2.7.15273.14004 describes an issue with just running TripleA.
I understand about how much time developers have. I understand this is being done on their own free time. What I don't understand is why there have been continual releases when the display still presents bad information with no visible attempt to correct the bad visuals. And now the game won't launch and there are still more releases which cannot even be checked.
In short what happened to the visuals after 2.7.15256 and when can we get a release that launches. Bad visuals and a game that does not launch equal a dead game.
Cheers...
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There are two pull requests which I request should be rolled back.
https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/releases/tag/2.7.15352 and https://github.com/triplea-game/triplea/releases/tag/2.7.15317 as both PR state that removing their blocks of code to 'remove crash triggers' or an 'remove illegalState checks'.
Neither blocks causes a map to crash. So why are they being removed.
"1941 Global Command Decision" is causing a lot of problems, one where a trigger would give an AI player some units and deduct the value of these units, but the AI player visuals showed 0PUs. This would throw the 'Not enough resources' error. The AI player really had 139PUs enough to deduct the 26PUs. Why was the game not showing the proper amount of PUs for the AI player? No one can answer this question. So instead of trying to figure out the real problem, the message caused by this problem is remove.
Another problem came when the AI player tried to place units into territories it visually didn't own but had been given ownership of in the xml. Instead of trying to figure out why these territories were not changing properly, the error message is removed.@frigoref said in Is TripleA finally dead:
PS: Putting such a statement / thread in a forum might even prevent new players to start playing and I assume no one here would like to see that happening.
@frigoref said in Is TripleA finally dead:
However, a supporting manner would be better than flaming about issues - even though the frustration might be high. TripleA is definitely NOT finally dead! (on the contrary, I am quite sure we can release 2.7 this year)
As long as error messages are removed instead of problems fixed, then yes 2.7 should be able to launch. DOA
Cheers...
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@wc_sumpton
I do not understand why you request the roll back of those PR, but you better discuss this with @LaFayette as he created them. Even if they are not solving the problem you have, they could still be legit.
Could you please provide a reproducible example for the problem(s) you are facing / refer to the GitHub issue in which this is described? Otherwise, it will be hard to answer the question "Why was the game not showing the proper amount of PUs for the AI player?".
PS: Please refrain from flaming further. I understand you are frustrated, but it is not helping to get things resolved again. We are all working here in good faith and the best intentions, there is not need for this.
