Iron War - Official Thread

  • Admin

    The Truk idea was a good one, and I have implemented it now. It was pretty difficult work to implement a new territory, but I was able to do it, even though I don’t feel like doing more of that. 😩 The islands look nice and I am satisfied with the quality of the graphics. 😌 For gameplay reasons Truk is located in the old Pacific Sea Zone 5, but geographically it should maybe be located in Sea Zone 4. 🙃

    Truk and Hawaii have starting factories. I can see that it opens up new possibilities for many players and that it opens up the pacific to more action. The US AI seems to now have a lot more focus on the pacific. Sometimes it focuses solely on going after Japan, even though it does seem just bypass Truk, maybe because Japan stacks units to prevent invasion. Sometimes USA splits its efforts to be 50% Europe and 50% Pacific.

    Either way this helps out Italy, as the USA seems not to go after Morocco that much, which is kind of a shame. But then again Italy seemed to be the first nation to fall of the tree major Axis players, so it gives them a break. Sometimes UK takes Morocco. A human US player could always go after Morocco.

    Japan seems to handle itself ok, but sadly it seems to have that German tendency of not building fleet power. It would be cool to see the Japanese and US navy try to battle each other more. Japan seems to focus solely on building army to fight on the mainland, especially try to kill off China and grab USSR territories.

    Truk has a starting army and a navy, including a Transport. It has a 61% chance of killing of the Hawaii fleet in round 1, but it would be hard/impossible to also invade with the 3 possible troops in round 1. The AI seems to always want to move this Truk fleet to go join up with other ships and use the troops to invade islands in round 1, and that seems good to me. AI will also seems to stack up units on Truk to prevent invasion, so if there are not 3 troops and a fighter on Truk from round 1, Japan will build here in round one and this will weakening its round two on the mainland, and that seems to be a big setback for Japan. So Truk must have starting units.

    Switch Teams? Like if the Axis are winning, Japan could suddenly jump ship and make its own team? Try to win with new war goals? And Germany could in return keep on being axis loyal or maybe join allies? I like the idea, and in the real WW2 I think the US actually thought about continuing on towards Moscow and bringing along the remnant German forces. Also it is a nice tribute to "man in the high castle". I am just not convinced that it would be a good idea to add this game changing feature. Also the tech realy stops around WW2 endgame, and does not take the future into account.

    To play this new version ASAP, delete your Iron War zip in downloadedMaps and redownload. Sometimes it takes a few attempt to redownload. But eventually it works.

    v0.1.4 to v0.1.5
    • Added ”Truk” territory (5 PUs) in the pacific.
    • Renamed Pacific Sea Zone territories to include Truk Lagoon Sea Zone.
    • Hawaii and Truk now have starting factories.
    • Bomber is now 7 attack not 8.

  • Moderators Admin

    I like the changes. This really adds some zesty zing to the Pacific.

  • Admin

    The first Truk version (v0.1.5) seemed to not have a balanced fuel setup. Especially Japan ran out of fuel pretty quick because of the new ships. I try to do a start setup and fuel balance that lets every player not run out of fuel the first two rounds, but after that they must become thirsty. 🍺 Here is a version that has fuel adjustments (unzip the xml and put it in the iron war zip in the downloadedmaps dir):
    PS: This new version is now the ingame downloadable one.

    Truk, 1940 🙂

  • Nice work. It seems like this map is coming along quite well 👏

    I'll have to try the new version out sometime soon. Truk certainly will make the Pacific more interesting.

  • Looks rad! I'm downloading the latest right now. I played a quick German solo earlier just to see how the Fast AI would handle the Pacific (using the file from before the fuel adjustment.) The Japanese AI used their starting fleet for island attacks, and then went West against India. But the US swooped on Truk and made it into a forward outpost for their own navy, which was pretty cool.

    In most of my games Japan likes to send their fleet far from home, frequently converging with the Italians in the Indian Ocean. Could be a relic of the AI going back to Revised gameplay, where the IJN in the Med is a pretty common occurrence hehe. Probably the Japanese AI is destined to slog it out on the mainland first and foremost. But at least in a game between humans I can see a lot of potential here in the Pacific for some naval action and island hopping back and forth! I dig it

    OK I got a new game fired up, this time as US solo vs Fast AI. I'm liking the Axis play so far. The German AI is using the remnants of their starting fleet to keep my transports off Iceland hehe. Nice one! I also like the way the Japanese AI is positioning itself on the water, keeping me off Truk for another round at least.
    0_1495150026317_Iron War Elk US Solo vs Fast AI Axis USA 2.tsvg

    The following round Japan went after the Australians! They also stacked up Truk with 10 hitpoints, digging in to make it a bloody affair. I like it!
    0_1495150774327_Iron War Elk US Solo vs Fast AI Axis USA 3.tsvg

    A few rounds later... the German AI is gunning full force after the Soviet Union, putting the serious heat on Leningrad then cracking Moscow and Arch. But it seems the British AI has decided that it's time for an early D-Day hehe, so I think I have to back the play, even though we just barely got set up on Africa. Meanwhile the Japanese AI are staying rather forward with their fleet this time, with IJN parked firmly in the Celebes Sea zone, to face down the USN which is now based out of Truk hehe. I think this addition is pretty fun, I think it can also work as like a stand in for some of the other island campaigns that may or may not occur in a given game, but at least here there is always at least one island flashpoint in the Pacific that the US can gun for early on. I'm enjoying it a lot. Nice work man!
    0_1495152137984_Iron War Elk US Solo vs Fast AI Axis USA 5.tsvg

  • Moderators

    Wow this map has come a long way! Can't wait to spend more hours on another Frostion masterpiece

  • Started another game USA solo vs fast AI. I'd say the balance of power feels pretty solid under the latest version.

    I think most of the remaining issues are AI related. Its kind of tough because the Fast AI seems more efficient and aggressive on attack, but it suffers from not prioritizing high value territories. So in this game for example, the US was able to swoop on Japan with a superior force, and had to face down only a handful of Japanese defenders on the home island. I think the Hard AI may be better at developing defense power for their core territories, even if its a little slow, so next game I think I'll try vs HardAI with a boost.
    0_1495221075707_Iron War Elk US Solo vs Fast AI Axis USA 8.tsvg

  • Admin

    Here is a new updated version of Iron War. This version has tried to enhance the map with some more PUs swapping/cooperation between some of the major players. I have tried to maintain some realism by only letting USA support the main Lend-Lease nations, and then let UK support British-India and ANZAC. The three major Axis players may support each other. It is only possible to support up to a fixed amount, so the ability to gang up on one player is kind of restricted.

    Also, I try to let the game and the nations still be able to run decently without anyone supporting anyone, like if the AI controls them.

    Also, USA, Iraq and Iran are now able to ship fuel to their major allies, and the system is AI compatible. They are the only three players that do always seem to have a surplus of fuel after ca. round 2 if the AI controls them, so all other major players would maybe want to receive some fuel at this point. Maybe AI players move more around than humans and use more fuel, I don’t know. But it seems fairly balanced now. If you test, please tell what you experience concerning fuel needs.

    v0.1.5 to v0.1.6 changes:
    • Balkan states no longer have music and end of turn sounds (so these sounds will not play for the German player if the game is started with the option “Balkan states are German” while also starting the game with the Balkan states as that same human player. This lead to five unwanted music tracks being played simultaneously after every German player turn).
    • Marines are now A2/D3 like Infantry, not A4/2D (still has amphibious +1A bonus)
    • Transport is now 0A/1D, not 1A/1D.
    • Added German, Italian and Japanese user actions to support each other with PUs.
    • Added British user actions to support British-India and ANZAC with PUs.
    • Added USA, Iraqi and Iranian possibility to support allies with Fuel. (AI compatible system)
    • More fuel availability adjustments.
    • Some other minor alterations.

  • Looks cool! Just downloaded about to fire up a Solo. I'm intrigued by the rework for the Soviets. Looks like the crash into Persia should be a little narrower now, but with more boots at the ready to absorb the German onlsaught. Down to 2 transports the Germans should have to really concentrate on gaining the upper hand against the Russians early. Those Soviets can stack pretty deep, so I might have to start sending the troops in Austria to the East now instead of using them in the Med transport actions hehe. Should be fun coming up with a new plan.

    I still wonder about Norway, whether it might see more action as True neutral? With everything else Germany has going on, probably becomes tough to send units up there, but if it was vulnerable to Allied occupation that might be a further incentive for G to hop on it.

    Can't wait to test out the new resource sharing!
    Nice work

    Catch you in a few

    ps. Ok just played the first few rounds. So far so good! I've noticed USA, Iraq and Iran all spreading the love around with that extra oil. The US was greasing the wheels all over the place, while Iraq/Iran threw some of their oil at Italy/Germany. The Russians feel like true titans here on the Eastern Front. I dig it!
    0_1495431987179_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies Germany 4.tsvg

    Decided to press my luck on the attack, with the hammer to Leningrad. Going toe to toe with Stalin, all-in, while I wait to see what the West will do. I've also been enjoying the show that the Japanese AI has been putting on down there by Australia. The Americans are still throwing their weight in oil around, this time sending some to France. Fun stuff!
    Here it is a round later, in early 1942...
    0_1495433064474_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies Germany 5.tsvg

    Going to see if I can sneak in another round or two before I pass out.

    7th Round still going... duking it out with the AI
    0_1495470999844_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies Germany 7.tsvg

  • Just caught this error for the first time... it fired off in the middle of the AI's last turn. I guess Stalin's head exploded from thinking too much about oil hehe. So far it hasn't crashed out the game or anything, but I will probably start a new one anyway.

    0_1495471888064_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies Germany 9.tsvg

    Loading map: iron_war, from: C:\Users\jason\triplea\downloadedMaps\
    Loading resources from the following paths: [C:\Users\jason\triplea\downloadedMaps\, C:\Program Files\TripleA_1.\assets]
    Loading map: iron_war, from: C:\Users\jason\triplea\downloadedMaps\
    Loading resources from the following paths: [C:\Users\jason\triplea\downloadedMaps\, C:\Program Files\TripleA_1.\assets]
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-USSRCombatMove: could not move [Medium-Tank owned by USSR] over Route:Ural -> Sverdlovsk -> Tatarstan because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 2 Fuel for this move
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-USSRNonCombatMove: could not move [Submarine owned by USSR, Submarine owned by USSR] over Route:North Atlantic 3 Sea Zone -> North Atlantic 5 Sea Zone -> Atlantic 7 Sea Zone because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 4 Fuel for this move
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-USSRNonCombatMove: could not move [SP-Artillery owned by USSR] over Route:Irkutsk -> Bartsk -> Khakassia because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 2 Fuel for this move
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-USSRNonCombatMove: could not move [SP-Artillery owned by USSR] over Route:Syria -> Transjordan because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 1 Fuel for this move
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-USSRNonCombatMove: could not move [Medium-Tank owned by USSR] over Route:Ural -> Yamalia -> Khanatia because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 2 Fuel for this move
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-USSRNonCombatMove: could not move [Submarine owned by USSR] over Route:Midway Island Sea Zone -> Pacific 5 Sea Zone -> New Hebrides Sea Zone because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 2 Fuel for this move
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-USSRNonCombatMove: could not move [Mech-Inf owned by USSR] over Route:Orissa -> India -> French India because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 2 Fuel for this move
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-USSRNonCombatMove: could not move [SP-Artillery owned by USSR, Mech-Inf owned by USSR] over Route:Orissa -> Nepal because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 2 Fuel for this move
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-FranceNonCombatMove: could not move [Mech-Inf owned by France] over Route:Gabon -> Equatorial Africa -> Ubangi-Shari because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 2 Fuel for this move
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-French-ColoniesNonCombatMove: could not move [SP-Artillery owned by French-Colonies, Mech-Inf owned by French-Colonies] over Route:India -> Orissa -> Nepal because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 4 Fuel for this move
    WARNING [Triplea start thread] ProAI -> 8-BritainNonCombatMove: could not move [Destroyer owned by Britain, Cruiser owned by Britain] over Route:San Diego Sea Zone -> Gulf of California Sea Zone -> Gulf of Fonseca Sea Zone because: Not enough resources to perform this move, you need: 4 Fuel for this move
    java.lang.OutOfMemoryError: Java heap space
    at java.awt.image.DataBufferByte.<init>(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.image.Raster.createInterleavedRaster(Unknown Source)
    at java.awt.image.BufferedImage.<init>(Unknown Source)
    at games.strategy.ui.Util.createImage(
    at games.strategy.triplea.ui.screen.Tile.createBlankImage(
    at games.strategy.triplea.ui.screen.Tile.getImage(
    at Source)

  • Started up a new full game. This time with Balkans under German control and an AI income boost of 25%. This time decided to take control of everyone on the Axis team, since I enjoy listening to the music play, and makes sure that only AI will get the extra cash.

    I went with an opening attack by the Truk fleet against the USN, but got beat back. Their carrier and battleship stood tall! So a minor setback for the Axis team there, but otherwise things are going as one might hope hehe.

    0_1495473400900_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Germany 2.tsvg

    Finally saw the US AI buy a factory for Liberia! haha
    0_1495474712805_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Germany 3.tsvg

    Sneaky Americans took Tokyo while we weren't looking 🙂 Nice one AI!
    0_1495477656257_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Italy 5.tsvg

  • Admin

    I have noticed that errors do pop up sometimes, especially when triggers try to remove PUs or resources from the players that have non, or like when AI wants to move units and does not have fuel for it. I have no idea about what to do when these non-game breaking errors occur 😞
    Also, there seems to be a problem when I load your latest save game and try to look at the history. This also triggers an error.

    Errors like the one popping up (“Could not set property:production subject:TerritoryAttachment attached to:Bulgaria with name:territoryAttachment new value:6”) is something I also see when playing. I think there is some sort of engine problem when showing history after the PU value of some territories has been altered, and this makes an error, especially when one wants to look at history ingame. In this case Bulgaria once had a PU value of 6 at game start, but by round 5 this has been altered by trigger to a new value of 3. This makes an error while looking at history. Help! @Developers

    About your last save:
    It looks to me as you handled the Axis pretty well, up to the point where you lost Japan to a “sneak” attack. (I have also made this mistake before 😜 ) It also seems to me that AI USA had a 90% focus on attacking Japan. Can I ask...

    1. When you play with AI +25% PUs, do you then bombard factories?
    2. Why does Italy have 39 colonial recruitment in the bank? Do you think the colonial troops are worth the buy?
    3. When you play as Germany, do you always send PUs to Finland, Iraq and Iran to keep them alive? I do.
    4. Di you support Thailand with PUs?
    5. Did you send PUs around between the Axis major powers?
    6. How was your need for fuel when controlling all three axis major powers? Were you thirsty? And were you dependant on Iraq and Iran to send their fuel to specific players? I can see that you have ended up with (before italian

  • @Frostion

    I'm kind of a capricious overlord, so I generally save all my cash and resources for the big 3 hehe. In the past I would usually assign Finland, Iraq, Iran, and Thailand to the AI, so it's kind of a new thing for me to take control over them.

    I haven't been bombing much lately, I tend to save that as a mop up tactic once it's a forgone conclusion. Or occasionally in retaliation for an AI bombing run. It still feels like a bit of cheap shot, though I suppose with the boost maybe the AI can handle it hehe.

    I usually buy the SS units little by little with Germany, but with Italy for whatever reason I will often let them stack up and then spam colonials at the end. They're definitely worth the cost. Cheap hitpoints are always a good buy haha. Not sure why but usually I'll go with magnified builds, like a bunch of aircraft, or mech or whatever at one time, rather than building up piecemeal. Buying infantry/art and air for several rounds saves on the resources, so when I finally unleash I usually have a fair amount banked to support the play. Since nothing is worse than grinding to a hault mid-move.

    Didn't do much fuel or cash exchanging that time, but might give it a go on the next run. Each time I start I new game I think about a new coordination plan, but then a lot of the time when the purchase screen comes up I'll forget it, and default to greedily spending the whole pile haha.

    Ps. Just did a quick first round under the same conditions, except this time I sent everything I could to Japan, to see how strong we could make them. Here they got 25 PUs from Germany, 25 from Italy and 10 fuel from Iran. This time we aim to keep Tokyo haha
    0_1495491779515_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Japan 1.tsvg

    When playing the AI I often give myself over to last minute, impulsive and reckless purchasing haha. Like just there with Japan, I'm sure I had a different thought last round, but sometimes its like, 'hey, lets scrap all that, go ahead and buy 9 fighters, why not!' lol
    0_1495493519466_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Germany 3.tsvg

    Looks like the tide is turning against us. A bit of overreach and some assassin strikes by KNIL set us back hehe. Probably should have broken Sumatra right off the bat. But fun stuff!
    Here we are in 43...
    0_1495498479235_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Germany 7.tsvg

    Anzac AI sent the pride of the IJN to the bottom of the Sea! haha Brilliant!
    0_1495500905208_Iron War Elk vs AI Allies x25 income Japan 8.tsvg

    @beelee For sure dude! You know how I like to go down, in a blaze of glory heheh

  • Admin

    @Black_Elk So the error is "java.lang.OutOfMemoryError: Java heap space" which means TripleA ran out of memory. You probably want to try increasing the memory to avoid that.

    The rest of the "WARNING" messages just indicate the AI tried to do something that wasn't possible. This won't cause any errors but just negatively impacts the AI's performance. It appears most of them have to do with the AI trying to move units that it didn't have enough fuel to move.

  • Admin

    @Frostion Umm I'm not aware of any errors related to changing territory PU values and haven't seen that error message before. Can you post the full error log and a save game to reproduce it?

  • Admin

    I used the last posted savegames of Black_Elk, and loaded it with the latest version of Iron War. Then I just went into history mode to look at round one, and this triggered the error.

    I can post the full error tomorrow if you want.

    Edit: In would imagine the error could be produced by starting a new game with the map option "Balkan states are German" on. This will change the five Balkan territories' PU value during round one. Then in round two one might look at history and trigger the error. But this is just my first thought.

  • Moderators

    seems as if you're having so much fun it should almost be illegal : )
    well... unless you're in Cal or AK or WA, Oregon... heh heh : )

    My bad sorry folks : )

  • Admin

    @Frostion You're correct. I easily reproduced using the setting in round 1 and there is a bug with the game history and changing territory production value. Here is the issue to track the bug:

  • Admin

    Before I report this as an issue, I would like to hear if someone has any ideas about what is going on. When playing as Germany and building a carrier in round one, placing it in the North Sea bordering West Germany, the engine seems to not let me choose what air units to move out onto the new carrier. I would like the 3 fighters to move out onto the carrier, but the engine only seems to let me move 2 air units (1 fighter and one bomber). Why is there no option to choose the 3 fighters instead?
    This happens regardless of any of the units have moved around on the map in combat or not.

    Here are some screenshots of the problem:



    Here are the units:
    <option name="attack" value="5"/>
    <option name="defense" value="6"/>
    <option name="movement" value="4"/>
    <option name="carrierCost" value="1"/>
    <option name="isAir" value="true"/>
    <option name="canScramble" value="true"/>
    <option name="maxScrambleDistance" value="1"/>
    <option name="canIntercept" value="true"/>
    <option name="canEscort" value="true"/>
    <option name="canAirBattle" value="true"/>
    <option name="airAttack" value="6"/>
    <option name="airDefense" value="6"/>

    <option name="attack" value="7"/>
    <option name="defense" value="2"/>
    <option name="movement" value="6"/>
    <option name="carrierCost" value="2"/>
    <option name="isAir" value="true"/>
    <option name="isStrategicBomber" value="true"/>
    <option name="bombingMaxDieSides" value="3"/>
    <option name="canIntercept" value="true"/>
    <option name="canAirBattle" value="true"/>
    <option name="airAttack" value="2"/>
    <option name="airDefense" value="2"/>

    <option name="attack" value="2"/>
    <option name="defense" value="2"/>
    <option name="movement" value="2"/>
    <option name="fuelCost" value="Fuel" count="1"/>
    <option name="hitPoints" value="2"/>
    <option name="isSea" value="true"/>
    <option name="carrierCapacity" value="3"/>

  • Admin

    @Frostion So it let's you pick 1 fighter and 1 bomber for a total of 3 carrierCost but won't let you select 3 fighters which would be the same cost?

    Edit: Does it automatically just select 1 fighter and 1 bomber when you choose "2"? Or are you doing something to specifically select those? My hunch is that it is just randomly selecting air units with carrierCapacity and there isn't a way to select specific air units.

    Edit2: If you remove the bomber from the territory, does it then allow you to select 3 fighters?

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