Map Tags for release 2.6
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I noticed a couple of days ago that LaFayette has been busy coding the use of map tags.
The first post contains the current thinking.
https://forums.triplea-game.org/topic/2801/map-tags-for-release-2-6?page=1Are there any more comments/suggestions?
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@lafayette @TheDog i dont understand the #3 rating for AI
"You should never have told me horses sleep standing up, it gave me a mental block." - Mister Ed
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@cernel American Civil War is a bit ethno-centric for 1861-1900, which had many other major wars. I would suggest for the nearly 1000 years between the Napoleonic Wars and WW1 using something like Wars of Empire, Imperial or Early Industrial.
I would also suggest 1946-1990 as Cold War.
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AI Rating Tag
Edited: Is Intended for single player v all AI players.
None - not rated
1 Does not play well using the AI or AI plays too slow
2 AI plays OK, using Fast or Hard AI
3 AI plays fast, using Hard AIOn older style maps, Fast AI is usually good enough, also Fast AI turns run faster than Hard AI turns.
What #3, rating is intended for is map/scenario that contains;
support attachments, expendable units or terrain effects (I might have missed some)
these require a Hard AI to get the best out of the map/scenario.Check Rogers Scenario thread, he makes a distinction between Hard and Fast AI.
An alternative to the ones listed above, AI rating could be;
Alternative AI Rating Tag
None = not rated
Dont = only play with Human players
Fast.. = can be played with Fast AI
Hard = should be be played with Hard AIWould this be better?
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@thedog you are saying there are some maps where the AI doesn't play any differently in fast or hard? that doesn't seem right to me.
my ratings for AI would be
1 incompatible (AI is not able to play this map effectively) example - TWW
2 passable (AI has some weaknesses on this map but can still put up a fight) example - G40
3 strong (AI is quite capable on this map) example - revised
not sure i agree that speed should even be a factor since AI will always go faster than a human and muddies the waters a bit in terms of the value of this rating
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@ubernaut
The AI rating is intended for new single players v AI.With your ratings how does a new player know which AI to use Fast or Hard?
Speed is very important for a single human player + AI verses the AI.
Seasoned/multi-players are expected to know what is best for their style of play.
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@thedog i don't think fast or hard should have anything to do with the rating the player can decide which is the best choice based on their own skill and/or patience level Hard AI still goes pretty fast even on complex maps, again much faster than a human would.
the rating should just be telling the player how effective the AI is at that map. even tho fast is quite a bit dumber now the basic kinds of problems AI has with maps is still basically the same (NOs, movement bonuses, sub/transports, complex builds).
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@rogercooper said in Map Tags for release 2.6:
@cernel American Civil War is a bit ethno-centric for 1861-1900, which had many other major wars. I would suggest for the nearly 1000 years between the Napoleonic Wars and WW1 using something like Wars of Empire, Imperial or Early Industrial.
Yeah, I agree (of course, you meant 100 years), and I don't like several of the naming proposals, either.
The correct name for 1451-1790 is "early modern".
A period like 1861-1900 is going to have 2 or 3 maps in total and would raise the issue wether or not "Domination" (an Anachronistic 20th century scenario based roughly on the years 1890-1914) is in it.
Maybe better to have 1451-1764 for the "early modern age" and then a single 1765-1869 section for the "revolutionary age" and then a single 1870-1928 section for "world war 1" (so that the Franco-Prussian war would be a World War 1 map too, for example).
I would also suggest 1946-1990 as Cold War.
Yeah, or "atomic age". Militarily, the few decades after World War 2 are basically the same as World War 2 plus the ICBM (beside the absence of horse-cavalry, which is missing in most WW2 maps too).
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@Cernel Im in broad agreement with your suggestions/conclusions.
So here is what Era/Age Tags mean;
Napoleonic and ACW now redefined as one, Revolutionary.
1946-2040 Nuclear (was Contemporary)
We use Nuclear and Atomic in common speech as the same thing, but here in the UK we use Nuclear more than Atomic?.
As Fast AI is only really used in maps that have lots of units and as hardware gets faster, Fast AI will fall out of use. For the purposes of Map Tags we should forget about Fast AI?See what @RogerCooper said
Fast AI is a lot faster when there are many units on the map. I often use it for large scenarios.
https://forums.triplea-game.org/topic/2920/if-the-fast-ai-was-removed-who-would-miss-it/9AI tag - could now look like this;
AI Rating Tag - Is Intended for single player v all AI players.
None - not rated
1 Does not play well or plays too slow
2 plays OK or well -
@thedog For the AI I would suggest.
- Satisfactory
- Hard only
- Unsatisfactory
It is possible that the tags might be need to be changed in the future. The biggest problem with the current AI being unable to run effectively on a given map is using multiple production resources, but that might change for some future version of the AI.
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I agree, words are better than numbers.
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@LaFayette has requested I list the current map tags, so getting ready for 2.6 release.
LaFayette as a minimum it would be nice to be able to sort each tag in ascending/descending order.
As a really nice to have, would be a filter on the Era Tag, so that when you select say 64-WW2-Global, it relists just the 37 Global maps, then you sort by Star or AI tags to help the player find the type of map they are looking for and then download it/them.
The Era Tag is prefixed with numbers to put the list in chronological order to aid with finding the desired era. the 60s are sub divided into 4 WW2 tags to aid in the type of map/theatre to search for.
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Era Tag
00-.....................................it is a new upload or not tagged yet
10-Fantasy
20-Ancient-Medieval
30-Renaissance
40-Revolutionary
50-WW1
60-WW2-Alternate
62-WW2-Europe
64-WW2-Global
66-WW2-Pacific
70-Nuclear
80-FutureStar Tag
Blank/no star...it is a new upload or not tagged yet
*...............................current Experimental tag
**.............................current Good tag
***..........................current Excellent tagAI Tag
Blank.........................it is a new upload or not tagged yet
Satisfactory...........the AI is exactly that
Hard only................only the Hard AI should be used
Unsatisfactory......the AI copes badly with the maps requirements -
@thedog 2 questions… we have 37 global ww2 maps? also, don't we have civil war maps or did i just imagine that?
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@ubernaut
I copied the 37 from my last count, checking today its 39 global ww2 maps.The civil war maps are in the 40-Revolutionary era tag, its years span 1765-1869.
There are 4 maps in this era 2 Napoleonic and 2 civil war maps.https://forums.triplea-game.org/tags/thedog
https://forums.triplea-game.org/topic/3741/curated-best-top-maps-triplea-guides -
@thedog never realized it was quite that many ww2 maps
i guess that revolutionary makes sense it just kind of threw me off i guess with only 4 maps it doesn't really make sense to split it off between enlightenment and victorian but yeah hopefully it doesn't confuse people trying to find maps 
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@thedog wait sorry one question so we don't actually have any us revolution maps? i would think someone would have done that by now
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@ubernaut
Those 2 maps are American civil wars.The English civil war is in the Renaissance era 1451-1764, I dont have any English civil war maps listed.
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@thedog ok now im getting even more confused, what english civil war? if you are referring to the war of us independence from england that definitely belongs in the revolutionary group, not the renaissance.
us civil war is definitely a "revolutionary" war but nobody refers to it as such here in the states. at any rate, if we are putting civil war maps in the revolutionary category and the "revolutionary war" in renaissance we are definitely going to be confusing us players.
"You should never have told me horses sleep standing up, it gave me a mental block." - Mister Ed
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@ubernaut
Hopefully this is clearer.Renaissance era English Civil War 1642– 1651
Revolutionary era American War of Independence 1775– 1783
Revolutionary era American Civil War 1861-1865 -
@thedog yeah that makes sense now
i guess i had never heard of the english civil war i think they thought it as cromwell's rebellion or some such here in the states
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