@Cernel said:

@KurtGodel7 said:

Anyone can attack Vichy French territory at any time, with no diplomatic repercussions whatever.

Pointing out that whatever rule for Vichy France is going to be not very realistic or very complex or both (so please nobody comes at me for not being "fully realistic"), I think it would be somewhat more realistic that there are no diplomatic repercussions for the Allies and the Japanese, whereas the Germans and the Italians attacking any part of Vichy France would cause all Vichy France to activate as a full fledged Allied power.

I also think that income giving can be simplified to Vichy France giving all its European production to Germany and nothing of the rest. There were some important shipments from North Africa, but, as a matter of agreements, losing any part of the empire would not have lowered the agreed payments due to Germany.

This game starts in June 1941, on the eve of Barbarossa. You could point out that as of that date, southern France was part of Vichy France. Germany annexed southern France in November 1942, as a response to Operation Torch. I decided to be a bit anachronistic here, and just treated all of France as already annexed as of the start of the game. For this map, "Vichy France" refers only to colonies controlled by the Vichy French as of June 1941.

In real life, the Vichy French colonies had provided Germany with resources and food. Vichy French Indochina had likewise supplied Japan with needed goods. That is why Vichy French colonies provide partial income to either Germany or Japan. Well, at least until those colonies get neutral farmed.

It can also be something less than its entire European production: I don't have much knowledge about how much the Germans were making in "real" terms after capturing the Free Zone as compared to before or whether or not they would have gotten more if they just conquered all European France instead of leaving French civil control and agreeing on a constant payment. Considering that the payments were reduced at some point (already happened if I understand the game starts right at the start of Barbarossa), it would make sense that Vichy France gives something less than its total European production (so long as this does not induce Germany to attack the Free Zone too early).

@KurtGodel7 said:

Anyone can attack Vichy French territory at any time, with no diplomatic repercussions whatever.

Pointing out that whatever rule for Vichy France is going to be not very realistic or very complex or both (so please nobody comes at me for not being "fully realistic"), I think it would be somewhat more realistic that there are no diplomatic repercussions for the Allies and the Japanese, whereas the Germans and the Italians attacking any part of Vichy France would cause all Vichy France to activate as a full fledged Allied power.

I also think that income giving can be simplified to Vichy France giving all its European production to Germany and nothing of the rest. There were some important shipments from North Africa, but, as a matter of agreements, losing any part of the empire would not have lowered the agreed payments due to Germany.

@Vendetta said:

@KurtGodel7 Much better on the maps now. The Gibraltar box looks exactly how I pictured. That could also be a good way to depict other small enclaves like Singapore, Hong Kong, etc at their proper size if you choose.

With regard to coloring Vichy, I understand the logic of simplicity there. But it still looks wrong visually just because France was an actual wartime belligerent and its territories were major historical theaters of operations, so it feels off to see them in the same colors as Spain or Portugal (and also makes it look like they’re all owned by the same power).

I guess part of what’s off-putting about it is that Flames & Steel has generally added more detail and depth versus the base G40 scenario, while this is one of the few cases where it feels like it’s consciously downgrading from the original.

Okay, here is the direction I'm leaning.

Vichy France will get its own color. Of the income from Vichy French territories, half (rounded down) goes to Germany. The other half disappears. Income from Vichy French territory in Indochina goes to Japan, again reduced by 50% and rounded down. Anyone can attack Vichy French territory at any time, with no diplomatic repercussions whatever. This adds 10 PUs to Germany and 3 PUs to Japan, at least at the start of the game. As Vichy French territory gets conquered this will decrease over time.

I've consumed 90% of my weekly usage despite being only halfway through my usage week. So the implementation of Vichy France may need to wait a few days.